Sorry your original question sounded like a gotcha because the answer to any question “How would a X solve the problem of another X group using violence to impose a patriarchal system on their group?” Is always exactly the same. Court, police, war.
Sometimes people are creative in coming up with alternatives to court, police, or war, though those alternatives aren’t guaranteed to succeed.
I admit I skimmed the article, but I got the impression that their response to ‘war’ was writing a zine. War usually involves two belligerent groups; a ‘war’ where there is only one group engaging in violence I think is more accurately called a massacre, an extermination, a holocaust.
I feel that equating the morality of organized groups to the morality of states reduces important complexity in the concept of the state. I also feel the devil is in the details. Perhaps a both liberal democracy and a monarchy (I understand you are a supporter of neither) would use tools described as ‘courts, police, and war’ – but I would prefer to face the courts and police of a liberal democracy than those of a monarchy.
Yea the devil is in the details, but the binary between state and no state is my main concern with the previous conversation. I think it’d actually be great if the police and military were rotated through the general population so we didn’t have a perpetual bully class and had people who could defend themselves. I think we should throw away representatives as a political class as equally trash as the buisnesses capitalist class and return to direct democracy with constitutional limits. Courts with a jury of your peers who need unanimous consent and a trained defendant is actually a pretty good system if the laws weren’t trash.
I think we’re on the same page being turned off by the anti-civ representatives of anarchist thought. Anarchism didn’t start on Usenet – it represents a much older, deeper, and inclusive tradition than some of its modern proponents give it credit for.
Anti-civ is so obsessed with authority over Anarchism’s boundaries because Anarchism historically has defined itself as an alternative form of organizing civilization, and Anarchism’s enemies were the ones claiming it was the enemy of civilization. I will admit though, the story of a person, faced with the horrors of capitalist civilization and capitalism’s propaganda of Anarchism, choosing the propaganda version of Anarchism, is anarchist as fuck. Kind of like Winston Smith embracing The Theory and Practice of Oligarchical Collectivism in George Orwell’s 1984.
You might find more affinity with the police abolition movement. They’re not focused so much on gatekeeping Anarchism as achieving a distinctly anarchist goal. In practice they are repealing unjust laws, eliminating unequal and racist enforcement of those laws, and reforming the job of police until it no longer qualifies as a capitalist enforcer class. Instead they are replaced by mental health professionals, de-escalation specialists, mobile notary publics, crisis investigators, and many other specialties that perform all of the social functions of police without the culture of violence and perverse incentives for incarceration.
Sorry your original question sounded like a gotcha because the answer to any question “How would a X solve the problem of another X group using violence to impose a patriarchal system on their group?” Is always exactly the same. Court, police, war.
Sometimes people are creative in coming up with alternatives to court, police, or war, though those alternatives aren’t guaranteed to succeed.
I admit I skimmed the article, but I got the impression that their response to ‘war’ was writing a zine. War usually involves two belligerent groups; a ‘war’ where there is only one group engaging in violence I think is more accurately called a massacre, an extermination, a holocaust.
I feel that equating the morality of organized groups to the morality of states reduces important complexity in the concept of the state. I also feel the devil is in the details. Perhaps a both liberal democracy and a monarchy (I understand you are a supporter of neither) would use tools described as ‘courts, police, and war’ – but I would prefer to face the courts and police of a liberal democracy than those of a monarchy.
Yea the devil is in the details, but the binary between state and no state is my main concern with the previous conversation. I think it’d actually be great if the police and military were rotated through the general population so we didn’t have a perpetual bully class and had people who could defend themselves. I think we should throw away representatives as a political class as equally trash as the buisnesses capitalist class and return to direct democracy with constitutional limits. Courts with a jury of your peers who need unanimous consent and a trained defendant is actually a pretty good system if the laws weren’t trash.
I think we’re on the same page being turned off by the anti-civ representatives of anarchist thought. Anarchism didn’t start on Usenet – it represents a much older, deeper, and inclusive tradition than some of its modern proponents give it credit for.
Anti-civ is so obsessed with authority over Anarchism’s boundaries because Anarchism historically has defined itself as an alternative form of organizing civilization, and Anarchism’s enemies were the ones claiming it was the enemy of civilization. I will admit though, the story of a person, faced with the horrors of capitalist civilization and capitalism’s propaganda of Anarchism, choosing the propaganda version of Anarchism, is anarchist as fuck. Kind of like Winston Smith embracing The Theory and Practice of Oligarchical Collectivism in George Orwell’s 1984.
You might find more affinity with the police abolition movement. They’re not focused so much on gatekeeping Anarchism as achieving a distinctly anarchist goal. In practice they are repealing unjust laws, eliminating unequal and racist enforcement of those laws, and reforming the job of police until it no longer qualifies as a capitalist enforcer class. Instead they are replaced by mental health professionals, de-escalation specialists, mobile notary publics, crisis investigators, and many other specialties that perform all of the social functions of police without the culture of violence and perverse incentives for incarceration.