I didn’t find any of the arguments compelling, I’m just not particularly enchanted by this electoral system because it’s a fig leaf for a bourgeois dictatorship, and has been for some time. Just because you vote doesn’t mean it’s a democracy.
My position is that the fix has been in for a lot longer, there’s been basically no US presidents that have actually represented the entire population, it’s always businesses and settlers first (hence all the wars)
as long as you’re choosing to be in that system, the will of the electorate should be exerted to its side host when choosing their president.
the alternative you are suggesting is that because there are outsized special interests influencing you a selection, people shouldn’t have any say.
which I cannot agree with.
it’s a popular, simple opinion, doesn’t require you to do anything but it certainly doesn’t change anything for the better or have any positive benefits.
nobody’s arguing that the fix you’re talking about isn’t in, those computer scientists and I agree that we should try to fix the fix.
the alternative you are suggesting is that because there are outsized special interests influencing you a selection, people shouldn’t have any say.
No, I’m saying that they never had a say, and you’re imagining popular power that never existed. For most of the US existence only white men could vote for one, the franchise was eventually extended but any influence voting has always been overdetermined by the existence of the electoral college.
The fixating on a few times the election didn’t go your way just looks like nursing bruised egos instead of focusing on productive work and developing a better understanding of our politics.
Regardless of the outsized influence special interests have, Americans have had and still have a say in who they elect.
you are fixating on how difficult change is instead of understanding that things perpetually change and it’s the fight to change systems that changes systems.
you’re fighting for futility, I’m advocating realistic change.
you might be bummed out because of the election results, but that’s no reason to stop making things better.
you’re still here and so is everybody else, and in the Cassandric words of steve Harwell,
you’re fighting for futility, I’m advocating realistic change
I’m saying the thing you’re fixated on is the futile thing, it assumes that this is a democracy (it isn’t) and that it’s “just special interests” (it’s the capitalist class writ large, they just bicker over who gets the reins)
I don’t think a qanon style campaign to stop the steal is realistic, but if you want to dress up like a fallout character and storm the capital in January more power to you.
The only way you can think civil rights are futile is if you have already given up.
If that’s the case, then take yourself out of the equation and stop talking about issues you don’t care about.
If you haven’t given up, explain how making sure people have civil rights is futile.
“it assumes…”
no, it doesn’t. you’re making assumptions, don’t do that.
“special interests” (it’s the capitalist class…"
Yes, those are special interests.
“I don’t think a qanon style campaign to stop the steal is realistic”
this is literally what I’m telling you. step away from qanon, Focus on real evidence and making changes that benefit people.
you’re fixated on the futility of everything, but you are incorrectly assuming that nothing can be changed because you are not willing to fight for that change.
that is simply incorrect.
people thought Trump was going to have his second term 4 years ago, and then he was voted out.
change happens all the time, you’re complaining that it can, despite overwhelming constant evidence that things are always changing.
you are incorrectly assuming that nothing can be changed because you are not willing to fight for that change.
I’m literally out there multiple days of the week organizing, we’ve fed thousands over the years.
In person organizing around addressing the material issues is what’s needed, not slapping a new coat of paint on the war machine every 4 years.
“the thing you’re fixated on is the futile thing”
The only way you can think civil rights are futile is if you have already given up.
I don’t think you’re fixated on civil rights, you’re fixated on winning a carnival game that I’m trying to explain to you is a sideshow compared to what’s going on outside the circus (and it has always been rigged).
Let me know if you need any help with your cosplay, I’m good with a sewing machine.
I didn’t find any of the arguments compelling, I’m just not particularly enchanted by this electoral system because it’s a fig leaf for a bourgeois dictatorship, and has been for some time. Just because you vote doesn’t mean it’s a democracy.
My position is that the fix has been in for a lot longer, there’s been basically no US presidents that have actually represented the entire population, it’s always businesses and settlers first (hence all the wars)
as long as you’re choosing to be in that system, the will of the electorate should be exerted to its side host when choosing their president.
the alternative you are suggesting is that because there are outsized special interests influencing you a selection, people shouldn’t have any say.
which I cannot agree with.
it’s a popular, simple opinion, doesn’t require you to do anything but it certainly doesn’t change anything for the better or have any positive benefits.
nobody’s arguing that the fix you’re talking about isn’t in, those computer scientists and I agree that we should try to fix the fix.
No, I’m saying that they never had a say, and you’re imagining popular power that never existed. For most of the US existence only white men could vote for one, the franchise was eventually extended but any influence voting has always been overdetermined by the existence of the electoral college.
The fixating on a few times the election didn’t go your way just looks like nursing bruised egos instead of focusing on productive work and developing a better understanding of our politics.
Regardless of the outsized influence special interests have, Americans have had and still have a say in who they elect.
you are fixating on how difficult change is instead of understanding that things perpetually change and it’s the fight to change systems that changes systems.
you’re fighting for futility, I’m advocating realistic change.
you might be bummed out because of the election results, but that’s no reason to stop making things better.
you’re still here and so is everybody else, and in the Cassandric words of steve Harwell,
“We could all use a little chaaaAAAnge”.
I’m saying the thing you’re fixated on is the futile thing, it assumes that this is a democracy (it isn’t) and that it’s “just special interests” (it’s the capitalist class writ large, they just bicker over who gets the reins)
I don’t think a qanon style campaign to stop the steal is realistic, but if you want to dress up like a fallout character and storm the capital in January more power to you.
“the thing you’re fixated on is the futile thing”
The only way you can think civil rights are futile is if you have already given up.
If that’s the case, then take yourself out of the equation and stop talking about issues you don’t care about.
If you haven’t given up, explain how making sure people have civil rights is futile.
“it assumes…”
no, it doesn’t. you’re making assumptions, don’t do that.
“special interests” (it’s the capitalist class…"
Yes, those are special interests.
“I don’t think a qanon style campaign to stop the steal is realistic”
this is literally what I’m telling you. step away from qanon, Focus on real evidence and making changes that benefit people.
you’re fixated on the futility of everything, but you are incorrectly assuming that nothing can be changed because you are not willing to fight for that change.
that is simply incorrect.
people thought Trump was going to have his second term 4 years ago, and then he was voted out.
change happens all the time, you’re complaining that it can, despite overwhelming constant evidence that things are always changing.
I’m literally out there multiple days of the week organizing, we’ve fed thousands over the years.
In person organizing around addressing the material issues is what’s needed, not slapping a new coat of paint on the war machine every 4 years.
I don’t think you’re fixated on civil rights, you’re fixated on winning a carnival game that I’m trying to explain to you is a sideshow compared to what’s going on outside the circus (and it has always been rigged).
Let me know if you need any help with your cosplay, I’m good with a sewing machine.
“I’m literally out there multiple days of the week organizing”
got it, thanks for that, but here you’re venting futility all out here without any reason to.
“I don’t think you’re fixated on civil rights”
that’s your problem right there.
“you’re fixated on…”
remember how you were wrong the previous times you tried to make assumptions?
you’re wrong here too.
If you care about helping people, be aware that your defeatist whinging here is counterproductive to your stated goals.
“not slapping a new coat of paint on…”
if you’re living in the states then you are literally slapping new paint on the war machine every 4 years.
where do you think your taxes go?
Yes that’s what I’m saying and it’s a little weird to be so invested in what color it is rather than addressing the material issues.
Have fun melting down over the election, I’m going outside.