The report is absolutely scathing. Some choice quotes:
But when the next crisis came, both the US and the governments of Europe fell back on old models of alliance leadership. Europe, as EU high representative for foreign affairs Josep Borrell loudly lamented prior to Russiaās invasion, is not really at the table when it comes to dealing with the Russia-Ukraine crisis. It has instead embarked on a process of vassalisation.
But āaloneā had a very specific meaning for Scholz. He was unwilling to send Leopard 2 tanks to Ukraine unless the US also sent its own main battle tank, the M1 Abrams. It was not enough that other partners would send tanks or that the US might send other weapons. Like a scared child in a room full of strangers, Germany felt alone if Uncle Sam was not holding its hand.
Europeansā lack of agency in the Russia-Ukraine crisis stems from this growing power imbalance in the Western alliance. Under the Biden administration, the US has become ever more willing to exercise this growing influence.
If you donāt want me to address points, maybe donāt bring them up?
About 8.2 million, thatās like 20%, have fled. Numbers oscillate but many are going back to help the war effort, sometimes even with children.
Believe it or not but a people might want to fight. Not just a leader, not just an army, but a people. Generally speaking you donāt want to piss off Slavs. Their national anthem (complete banger, no, not Funk) is about pretty much nothing else but this. First used 1917, then Russia happened, then in use since 1995, and now Russia happens again. If you have a look at different anthems of eastern European states many contain language such as āOur country isnāt lost, yetā, āWe havenāt yet perishedā, each and every time itās referring to Russia.
If you get your information from European media, youāre not getting told those kinds of cultural and historical background because they donāt need to be said. If you get your news from the US itās likely that itās at least interspersed with Kremlin propaganda. They donāt understand why Europe is fighting, either, they just want to bonk some Russkis, donāt want to be seen not doing anything while the rest of NATO is up in arms, but also need to be dragged into doing things ā because they donāt understand Russia.
This war would already be over had Ukrainians received better support from the start.
First off, no because Ukraine will have won long before then. Secondly, no because if the war was going badly for Ukraine (it isnāt) Poles etc. would volunteer en masse. Speaking of Poland the only reason their military isnāt in Ukraine right now is because NATO also is a leash.
As the joke goes, two Polish veterans meet in a bar. Asks the one: āSuppose Germany and Russia again invade us at the same time. Who do we shoot at first?ā ā āEasyā, says the other, āThe Germans: Business before pleasureā.
Yes. Thatās why they have to be kicked out by force.
And here I thought you said you wanted to learn more about Russia. That poem describes the Russian soul and its own exasperation with it.
As to the more general point of āRussia is losingā: I guess itās useless to argue further, youāve made up your mind. Ukraine and its people disagree with you.
Go start watching the progress of war more closely (about any youtuber going over maps, try e.g. this one). Promise me youāll eat your shoes if Ukraine wins in under a year from now and I promise I will neither gloat nor insist you actually do it.
I actually only want you to address one specific point, but you keep bringing up completely irrelevant cultural or moral tangents and neglecting to keep the conversation on the very material subject on which I started this conversation. I am merely addressing those points and specifically how they donāt matter to this discussion. If I may say so, it looks like youāre intentionally avoiding the subject.
If I need to repeat myself yet again, how come āRussia canāt even match Ukraineā if, as youāve implied multiple times, Ukraine is dependant on NATO support (a group theyāre no part of) to push back the current Russian occupation that has remained more or less in place for over an year? And how does this entire 1 year history of war not show that Russia has actually at least matched Ukraine? Possible future prospects or āwhat couldāve happenedā donāt matter when analysing the reality of the past 1 year of the war.
It is completely okay to admit you were being hyperbolic there, but you insist in not even acknowledging those points, much less arguing against them, while trying to lecture me about some intrinsic characteristic of Slavic peoples.
Random moral and ethnic tangents from somebody who canāt stop.
And yet, men aged over 18 are barred from leaving. According to the UN, 90% of those who left are women and children. Iām sure you donāt actually think every single Ukrainian adult man wants to stay. Many are doing unconventional methods to bypass this ban, which are not accessible to all. Believe it or not, but some people donāt want to fight. Keeping them there against their will does not save Ukrainian lives.
So what youāre saying is that NATO news outlets that bend over backwards to support Ukraine are actually parroting propaganda from their enemy? Are the only reliable propaganda-less sources the Ukraine military and the youtubers youāve mentioned at this point? Also Iām pretty sure not everybody is a Ukraine nerd in Europe, so the European news would still have to explain how Slavic peoples are so different and how that uniqueness impacts the war, which has had severe material impacts to all of Europe. Iām pretty sure not everybody in your neighbourhood is an expert in both the Scots, Portuguese and Libyans.
Wouldāve, couldāve, shouldāve. This is all speculation that 1) Ukraine is going to win, or 2) Poland would go against NATO to participate in the war. Either way, it still demands more blood for the blood god which is a weird way of saying āyes, I think itās safe to assume that escalation will follow rather than cutting losses in case Ukraine doesnāt winā. I guess in order to save Ukraine every Eastern European should go die and kill there? Is this about saving Ukrainian lives or Ukrainian soil at this point?
Which goes directly in the face of your portrayal of them as being unrealistic in their demands. If in order to get your peace demand you need to completely shift the tide of the war, maybe your demand is the most tenuous one. āRealisticā demands for peace include only what is practical for both sides to achieve in the current moment, not ones that might be possible in some future that one side hopes for.
I guess I misspoke but I have no interest on Russian literature or poetry, but rather the material realities of the people, whatever their ethnicity and culture. No song is going to inform me about whether or not Russia currently controls Donetsk or Crimea, and insistence on such subjective media rather than the established facts brings nothing of use to the table. And again, summarising one entire diverse country by a single song seems awfully simplistic.
I donāt think I need āUkraine and its peopleā to agree with me on this seem Iām not talking to them right now and theyāre not a single hivemind with only one opinion. As youāve said, 20% of them have even fled, though you also failed to provide a source. What Iām stating is a simple statement, āRussia has achieved its war goals and therefore has matched Ukraineā, and instead of explaining why Iām wrong you keep deferring to songs, youtubers and some bizarrely reductionist notions of ethnicity. If you donāt wish to talk about it, donāt waste your typing fingers beating around the bush. You seem to be mixing your moral feelings about the war with your material analyses, and thatās generally not helpful even if you end up correct in the end by a stroke of luck.
But if you do want to actually explain to me how āRussia canāt even match Ukraineā despite the course of the war so far, without resorting to hopes and dreams and speculation or including foreign factors like NATO support, Iām all ears actually.
Iāll actually eat my food like any other day. Iāll not even shed a tear or smile. Believe it or not, I donāt spend much of my time thinking about this war amidst all other world issues. I donāt have any stake in it and I donāt care which side wins in the end, which is why I donāt bother speculating on the future. Iām rather interested in this war ending whatever it takes with the least harm done to all peoples, and if it takes the Russian annexation of lands it currently controls, the human rights situations can be sorted in peacetime. Besides, this war is really annoying for global geopolitics even though nobody even knew where Ukraine was on the map 2 years ago. Theyāre not that relevant out there to anybody but Eurocentrists.
lmao imagine thinking that some generic European anthem is a banger compared to Funk music or literally any genre from outside Europe. Canāt wait to listen to the baroque choir on my Spotify. āDeutschland Deutschland Ć¼ber alles, Ć¼ber alles in die Weltā derivatives is definitely something the world loves listening to. Is there even good music coming from Europe since Daft Punk retired?
But since you offered, I offer you back Guantanamera as an olive branch, because Iāve been listening to it the other day.
Reminder: Russia has matched Ukraine militarily, and Ukraine is just now possibly getting to match it back. This is not a moral statement. Reply to that first, then you can proceed to tell me about your understanding the intricacies of Slavic culture.
No, but this is war. Even if youāre not needed on the front lines youāre needed repairing infrastructure or baking bread. I donāt buy the āI need to protect my wife abroadā thing btw youāre moving to Poland or Germany, not Somalia.
No Iām saying that America is infiltrated by Russian assets and theyāre being quite oblivious to how Russia operates in that regard. Russia has successfully had Americans at each otherās throats for a good 20 years now.
Even if we accept the āthey only want those territoriesā idea: Noone has achieved any goals before the war is over. They also have to hold those territories ā and probably also want to get rid of sanctions. War is the continuation of politics by different means (Clausewitz, read him), as long as Ukraine doesnāt cede to Russiaās claim, or is forced to, Russiaās political and thus war goals are not achieved.
The whole thing was in response to āEurope needs the US to be protected against Russiaā. Thatās the context. No, Ukraine could not stand against Russia without foreign help, at least not in the way it is now ā weād see a partisan war.
But given that Ukraine, with all this backing, still has a smaller military capacity than the rest of Europe, no, Europe isnāt reliant on the US for its own protection. As said, France alone could do it. NATO could vanish and weād be fine (if a bit disorganised) as the EU, too, is a mutual defence pact. Article 42 (7) TEU. Turkey would be left in the dustā¦ well, technically, thatās why the US has always been keen on undermining EU military integration, but in reality weād have their back if Russia tried to do shit. Not that they could Turkey is armed to the teeth, the only thing theyād have trouble with is fighting a two-front war, Russia and Greece.
Generally speaking if I hear āThe US is defending Europeā itās usually from Trumpists or, I guess this proves the horseshoe theory, Tankies.
Is not our national anthem. Yep the GDR one was better.
But more to the point, as to banger national anthems, try the Tuvan one, complete with throat singing.
As to European music, motherfucker. Probably 90% of the worldās metal output is written here and countries which are unable to produce metal (such as France) then rock when it comes to other things, in Franceās case, Electronica. Case in point, have some minimal Techno. But to circle back to Ukraine, have some Heilung.
There we have it. Thank you for finally stopping the assumption that Iām arguing some grander point than I was. Russia can match Ukraine. We can move on from this now. Only took some 10 replies.
You do know that there are other reasons for people to not want to be in a warzone other than āprotecting wifeā, donāt you? Not going into the Somalia/Germany comparison there, but there are people, be they bakers, engineers or even soldiers, that have fled from Ukraine, but are legally barred to do so. What do you think of those men who only wish to leave Ukraine and the war but legally canāt? Iād bet there are even some ethnic Russians and other minorities from Ukraine thatād rather not be part of it too. Not to protect some elusive wife, but to protect themselves.
Then weāre just arguing semantics. Russia currently controls most of the claimed regions and if God demanded an armistice theyād keep most of it. It is up to the Ukrainian forces to change that if they insist on war. They donāt need to wait for some formal declaration of peace so long as they hold the regions. They have de facto achieved their goals. Both Korean countries claims jurisdiction over all Korea, but they donāt have much authority in each other lands. It would be plainly ignorant for either to demand the other to unconditionally cede their domain. But it would also be nonsensical to claim then that either is trouncing the other given they canāt push each other out of their respective domains. The ball is on Ukraineās court to take the lands back if they so wish, which means theyāre on the losing side right now. Youāre missing the forest for the trees on that one.
Iām confused. Where are the Tankies in this? Are we Trump? The USA? Europe? The Leopards? If you people are at war with each other and the USA helps out, what do we have to do with it? Are we asking the USA to defend or attack Europe? Very confusing.
Or do you refer to the USA protecting European capitalist interests (which donāt include the interests of the working class Europeans) by destabilising foreign powers that pose a threat to European imperialism? Well, if that is the case, Iām not sure how the wars on Iraq, Libya or Afghanistan, or the dozen interventions in America Proper helped the working class Europeans. If yāall really donāt like the Unitedstadian support, please do ask for a referendum to leave or disband NATO. Youāll find plenty of leftist support worldwide.
Ah yes, Unitedstadians havenāt been famously killing and oppressing their own before Putin got into power. The FBI is a KGB branch and all.
sounds neat, reminds me of this monster hunter track
Iām sorry, neither of those are really that popular out there. K-pop, Funk and hip-hop variants are really blooming though. Also why is the Ukrainian one German and singing in English? Either way, have yet another cultural wonder from far away.
ā¦says the one with a lemmygrad account.
Iād actually be in favour of that but at the same time would worry about what the US will be doing without our moderating input.
When it comes to intervention abroad the US and EU have vastly different outlooks (even though France kicked off Libya).
Random recent example, take Mali: Their government said āHelp we have ISIS here and canāt deal with itā, France said āNo problem my old colonial subject weāll solve itā, Mali said āWe know the French, they are arrogant and are only going to stomp ISIS, then leave us as defenceless as we were beforeā upon which Germany said āWe also know the French, yes theyāre arrogant weāll train youā. Thus France went to fight, and Germany went to train. Then, and this is a bit speculation, Russia bribed some top Mali brass in any case the net effect was a military coup in Mali, the Junta then inviting Wagner over and their military started to massacre random people in joint operations with Mali. France and Germany promptly left and/or suspended operations, Wagner trying to blame the human rights abuses on France (playing into general anti-French propaganda Russia has been peddling in the region for quite a while). And no they didnāt do anything to combat ISIS they only made things worse.
How many points in that ā coming when invited, doing a clean job, leaving when asked, would you expect the US to do? The European sentiment is that the fucked-up internal state of Mali politics cannot be solved by imposition from the outside, they will have to find their own way out of it, sure if they want we can lend a hand but ultimately itās their responsibility to not fuck up their own country. Itās a kind of non-interventionist interventionism. We are precisely limited by not backing dictatorships, unlike Russia which prefers people who it can bribe, China which actually doesnāt care one way or the other, regarding it as simply business, and the US well theyāre not even really in Africa but you know all to well how they treated, and are treating, South America. 60 fucking years and theyāre still pissed Cuba dared to rebel against them as colonial overlords.
Side note yes you should totally look into Wagnerās operations in Africa. If that doesnāt look like an attempt at colonialism then I donāt know what does.
Who needs K-pop when you have the insanity that produces Eurovision.
I meanā¦ itās respected. Itās funky. But also rather specific, or alternatively used as ingredient in other styles. But speaking of Eurovision. No I donāt know what that is, either, thereās a reason thereās a gazillion Eurovision drinking games.
Hmm. K.I.Z. is all the rage among the younger lefties but I could never really get into hip-hop. Other bands make other kinds, cult classic not in the least because of the lyrics, and then, well, over here everything ultimately turns out metal.
Not German, Germanic would fit better, genre is proto-germanic ritual folk. The band is as much German as Norwegian as Danish and the relation to Ukraine is in the theme and lyrics of the song. Ukrainians, btw, are an age-old mixture of Slavic and Germanic culture, Vikings settled there when travelling between the Baltic and Black Sea and mixed with the local Slavic population starting about 750CE.
As to Ukrainian music ā Iām a bit stumped but thereās definitely Jinjer. They also punch way above their weight in Eurovision, counted by wins per time participated they lead the pack.
But as I didnāt accost you with enough metal yet Iāll add what should have been Germanyās entry last year before the powers that be decided it to be ānot suitable for radio playā, which radio stations then promptly commented by playing it up and down.
You know I tried to come up with South American artists but failed twice ā first idea was Manu Chao, but the guy is French of Basque-Galician descent, and then Santana, well, closer, at least heās (originally) Mexican.
If you ask around in Spain or Portugal theyāll know more of your stuff. And, just remembered, for some reason DTH are popular in Argentinia.