That’s painful just to read it.

I don’t think it would, this is a very different situation than those ones I laid out where a person is insisting that some character must be trans because they believe it as their headcanon, but believe their headcanon is objectively correct because [intert justification here]. So I don’t think this is remotely an issue here.

Why would you trust the Merriam Webster Brand account? Have you seen brand Twitter lately? Don’t trust the people behind these accounts, they’re only doing it for clicks.

Oh my god I just said this the other day. It would be very funny if that somehow happened and they sent it back to France. We really don’t deserve it.

You can just buy them, they’re not expensive. At least I don’t think they are. Are they?

No one is bullying or attacking you, we’re calling you out for making shitty bad faith arguments about free speech and also refusing to acknowledge or respect this instance’s rules on misgendering others and gatekeeping. Which by the way, the Egg Prime directive is only an extension of.

I agree, what they’re saying reeks of that garbage “Freeze Peach” bullshit, and trying to argue for the right to misgender others in privately owned spaces.

I should note this comment is about discussion among trans people, I basically don’t trust cis people to not stomp on toes while doing this.

Good, I’m not a cis person (despite the gatekeeping transphobic idiots who say I am).

Ultimately we need to ask if the egg prime directive is there for us to serve it or it to serve us. If we’re at the point that some trans people feel they can’t talk about trans interpretations of fictional characters without being afraid of getting banned, that’s a messed up application of the rules.

The Egg Prime directive is here to serve all queer people, all of LGBTQIA+. It exists because people deserve to be themselves and not have their identity invalidated for it. It is being enforced more strongly here and now because a lot of people unfortunately do not recognize in their hearts how calling someone an egg based on presentation is a bad thing, or just how bad it is. And actually this interpretation about misgendering characters isn’t really new. Blahaj has always had rules against misgendering as a whole, even towards fictional characters.

A headcanon is different and people can have headcanons though it must be clear they are headcanons, what people on the old r/egg_irl have done where they try and force it as the only true interpretation and attack people who disagree with them and screech transphobia at them (without any transphobia happening might I add). Absolutely crosses the line.

It’s very important to remember that headcanons are headcanons, and I bring this up because there are people that try and argue that they are the objectively and only correct version, and try and say that people who don’t follow that person’s headcanons are transphobic.

It becomes problematic when it becomes misgendering, fictional misgendering doesn’t fly, even though it is fictional. When a character openly and repeatedly affirms their identity as a boy, at that point we’re straddling the line between head-canon and misgendering and at that point if someone decides to force it onto people and insist it isn’t a headcanon (like I called out above) it becomes an example of fictional misgendering.

Would Bridget have become canonically trans if that freedom was taken away from people?

You mean if Bridget had been written to be a feminine boy and said she was a boy? No, it just wouldn’t happen. People can have their headcanons but if Bridget had stayed canonically a femboy those would just be headcanons and people wouldn’t be able to force them onto non-believers or accuse people of transphobia for not believing them.

If on the other hand you mean the series was abandoned and there is no more canon with only new fanmade content being produced the situation changes, like what you mentioned with Xenia, the old Linux Mascot.

That’s one of the most bad faith statements I’ve heard in a while. You’re basically saying that any attempt to silence people who happen to be queer, even if they are saying legitimately hurtful things, is wrong and makes you conservative. This isn’t true though. In fact, lemmy.blahaj.zone’s admins are more than happy to ban people if they are harmful, gatekeep people’s identities, or intentionally spread queerphobia themselves, and it doesn’t matter if they are queer or not.

Are you trying to say that horrible people should be allowed here just because they’re queer? Because that makes no sense, this place (Blahaj) being a safe space means that all harmful speech and content is removed, not just from non-queer people.

Just Lemmy-UI

I don’t agree with that, and if someone creates a post saying that Felix or Astolfo are eggs and people need to accept that they’re trans girls in denial, that post will be removed just the same as a post that directly and blatantly misgenders fictional characters would be. Egging in those contexts is blatant misgendering, some cases like the one the OP mentioned aren’t so bad and will be left up, even though I’ll still personally and morally judge them.

Misgendering though doesn’t fly here, that’s actually also a Blahaj rule too, people who misgender others, even fictional characters can get banned from Blahaj for it. I’ve seen it happen before.

Oh and by the way, yes it is different to say that Bridget is trans than it is to say that Felix is trans, because bridget is canonically trans, while Felix blatantly says “I am a boy”. So that’s not a gotcha there. Fictional misgendering is misgendering, and that’s not up for debate or argument.

Egg in this case is slang to mean someone who is trans and in-denial of it. The Egg Prime Directive means that you can’t go calling random people eggs, though officially it’s a bit more complex.

I just want to say, I left the post up because it was a fictional setting and said post doesn’t actually break the egg prime directive. Though I will still criticize it on that merit because the thing is. Violations of the Egg prime directive are seen way too lightly, and as I said in my other comment aren’t really recognized in our hearts as being as harmful as they really are. It’s why people even think they’re funny or relatable when a similar situation making light of transmisogyny wouldn’t be. Of course displays of fictional transmisogyny are permitted when they have value or share experiences but they are handled in a much different and more serious way, and egging just isn’t handled that way. Like I said most people don’t recognize it in their hearts as being as bad as it is.

I think this is a problem because if we don’t recognize why it’s bad, we’re more likely to decide there are situations where its okay. Even the community chosen name “Egg Prime Directive” is misleading because the Prime Directive in Star Trek is very morally flexible, and indeed one could argue should be broken to save a people from disaster or even from ignorance. That is not the case with the Egg Prime Pirective, because trying to break someone’s egg so to speak or force them to “be trans” is going to be a very traumatic experience for most people, and for people who aren’t actually trans, is straight up gaslighting and misgendering.

Side note: Meta posts are permitted here, though it’s traditional that they contain a meme or image in meme format. It also makes them easier to repost on Lemmy if someone wishes to repost it elsewhere and continue the discussion there.

Honestly I get where you’re coming from but I do not agree with you. People are way too comfortable in this day and age speculating about other people’s gender identities and sexuality, and part of that comes from the fact this behavior hasn’t been called out in the past anywhere near as much as it should. It is unfortunately thought to be still acceptable by many people. The thing is, Egging is misgendering. Is misgendering permitted in fictional situations? To an extent. Though it should be made clear it’s wrong. Egging is problematic because it historically hasn’t been thought of as wrong and the attitude around it is still way too casual.

Please try to understand that this phenomenon has not really stopped yet, people are still egging each other right now. It has been seen as more and more wrong sure, but only the absolute worst versions of it are ever called out or portrayed in any way negatively, and the idea that gender non-conformity doesn’t determine gender identity is still not widely acknowledged. It was only in 2013 that they dropped Gender Identity Disorder from the books as an actual medical diagnosis. It is way too soon for egging to be looked at casually, as something that isn’t harmful. There may be and I do hope there is a day when it won’t be such an icky topic, but that day isn’t today, and probably isn’t going to be for a very very long time. As it stands it is not widely and intuitively known in most people’s hearts that egging is bad, in the way that they know that general misgendering is bad.

I did actually write a more in-depth post about it, which I might embed in the sidebar to help people find it easier.

They’re calling OP an egg, in blatant and direct violation of the Egg Prime Directive.

I know that, but you’re still more deserving than we are.

Who told you or implied you weren’t? Under the Egg Prime Directive that is not allowed.

Seriously, it’s really not okay to go around telling other people that they are or aren’t something personal and self-defined as gender identity.

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