“We believe the prerequisite for meaningful diplomacy and real peace is a stronger Ukraine, capable of deterring and defending against any future aggression,” Blinken said in a speech in Finland, which recently became NATO’s newest member and shares a long border with Russia.

  • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    19
    arrow-down
    17
    ·
    1 year ago

    That is absolutely not what the west is doing. Ukraine is being used as a proxy to weaken Russia using the formula that RAND outlined here. All the west is accomplishing is prolonging the conflict and it will not change the outcome. Anybody who thinks this is being done for the benefit of Ukraine is absolutely delusional.

    Maybe people living in the west should focus on stopping their empire from conquering countries before getting on their high horse.

    • FlowVoid@midwest.social
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      21
      arrow-down
      11
      ·
      1 year ago

      Nah, I prefer to stop countries from annexing pieces of other countries.

      The US hasn’t annexed anything since 1959, and I was born too late to stop that. But Russia can’t help itself, and even gives youngsters a chance to oppose annexation.

      • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        17
        arrow-down
        19
        ·
        1 year ago

        Maybe you should figure out how to stop your own regime from invading countries before playing world police then. US is literally occupying part of Syria as we speak. Just how ignorant are you exactly?

              • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                11
                arrow-down
                10
                ·
                1 year ago

                Around a third of a country including major food and oil producing regions. Are you in a cave where google isn’t available?

                • FlowVoid@midwest.social
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  14
                  arrow-down
                  12
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  Huh, I didn’t realize that we had a 51st state. Who is the new governor?

                  Wait, I just looked at a map. It turns out the US borders haven’t changed. Are in you in a cave where the definition of “annexation” is unavailable?

                  • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    English
                    arrow-up
                    12
                    arrow-down
                    11
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    Oh I’m sorry, your shithole country is only occupying Syria without having officially incorporated the regions you’re pillaging. That makes it totally different. 🤡

    • MikeTheComrade@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      19
      arrow-down
      19
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s really sad how duped American citizens are here. They truly believe that when changing their bio pics to a Ukraine Flag that they’re doing something. They believe their government has the best interest of Ukraine while what they’re actually supporting is their government using Ukrainian bodies to weaken an adversary under the guise of defense. No one learned anything after Iraq, it was mere MONTHS ago that liberals were giving BUSH praise! They don’t care about Abu Ghraib or what happened in Guantanamo Bay. A lot of people here are in for a rough awakening.

      • JillyB@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        20
        arrow-down
        11
        ·
        1 year ago

        I’m confused. Do you think Russia taking Ukraine by force is what’s best for Ukraine? Do you think their people are volunteering to fight because they just don’t know what’s best for them? Even if Ukrainians wanted to maintain independence out of some misguided patriotism, isn’t it their right as a sovereign nation to decide that?

        From the US perspective, Ukraine wanted to join NATO, aligning themselves with us. Then Russia invaded. If the US didn’t support Ukraine, the world would know they can prevent a weaker country from joining NATO by invading. After Iraq and Afghanistan, there’s no desire to send US troops but we can provide weapons and intelligence.

        • ImOnADiet [he/him]@lemmygrad.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          11
          arrow-down
          6
          ·
          1 year ago

          I personally don’t think it’s going to matter much for the average Ukrainian, as far as who controls their resources. I think it’s a tragedy that they’re fighting or dying over whether it’s Russian oligarchs or western oligarchs who will get to control their lives

          • Tretiak@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            11
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            To me it’s still hilarious that Americans themselves don’t think the government has a cynical, vested interest for getting involved in Ukraine. How the hell so many average liberals became hawks that dance to the neocon war drum, is still puzzling to me. Especially when it was their own side that produced the overwhelming evidence of American Foreign Policy that stands confronting people.

        • MikeTheComrade@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          8
          arrow-down
          4
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Weapons, intelligence and Ukrainian bodies are an extremely cheap deal to weaken an adversary, don’t you think?

          When it comes to wanting oil though, US and Iraqi bodies aren’t so important. As long as you can dupe your own citizens into believing there’s WMD’s, it doesn’t matter.

          And of course Ukraine knows what’s best for them. That’s why they keep asking for a roadmap to NATO but the US is like “Nah” - https://www.ft.com/content/c37ed22d-e0e4-4b03-972e-c56af8a36d2e

          So of course they’re left to negotiate. Again, the US Government doesn’t care but their citizens think they do.

          The US is against peace if it doesn’t get more money to the military–industrial complex or if it doesn’t weaken an adversary, like in this case.

          • Tretiak@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            5
            arrow-down
            3
            ·
            1 year ago

            The US is against ‘any’ attempt by any country to use its resources for its own purposes. America behaves like any other imperial power has, throughout history. If Russia or China had the power the US currently does, they’d be doing the same thing. It’s why ‘Empire’ as a concept can coexist just as easily with ‘democracy’ as a framework as it does in autocracies. Because every State out there wants to maximize it’s share of power in the world. And this includes the US. That’s why fundamentally things don’t change all that much, regardless of who gets into power.

      • FlowVoid@midwest.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        19
        arrow-down
        12
        ·
        1 year ago

        The people of Ukraine have told the world what their best interest is: removing Russian soldiers from their land, by force if necessary.

        The US is only interested in Ukraine when their goals align. Everyone knows this, including most Americans and most Ukrainians.

        However, it turns out that US and Ukrainian goals do, in fact, align. The US isn’t “using” Ukraine any more than Ukraine is “using” the US. They are openly cooperating to achieve a common interest.

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          arrow-down
          13
          ·
          1 year ago

          The Ukrainian people are being kidnapped off the street and sent to die by the regime US installed in Ukraine after overthrowing a democratically elected government. Most Ukrainians don’t want to have a war and have their lives destroyed. The only people who want this war are ghouls living in the west who aren’t personally affected by it.

          • FlowVoid@midwest.social
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            9
            arrow-down
            6
            ·
            1 year ago

            Tankies can always be counted on to project the worst in themselves.

            There are hundreds of thousands of Russians in Georgia and Kazakhstan who can explain which side is kidnapping young men off the street and sending them to die for a war they care nothing about. Meanwhile, opinion polls of Ukrainians consistently show that an overwhelming majority want to continue the war until Russians are defeated.

            • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              5
              arrow-down
              11
              ·
              1 year ago

              We have plenty of video evidence of this happening in Ukraine, but whatever you say my little dronie. And yeah, opinion polls mean so much in a country that’s now effectively a military dictatorship.

              • FlowVoid@midwest.social
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                If you don’t believe in opinion polls, then your claim that most Ukrainians are against the war is based on nothing but the voices in your head.

              • JasBC@beehaw.org
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                2
                arrow-down
                3
                ·
                1 year ago

                …nice, your stance must mean Russian-ones meant shite before the war even began then right?

      • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        18
        arrow-down
        18
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Americans are subject to the best propaganda machine that money can buy, and people running the regime are certainly getting their money’s worth.

        • Tretiak@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          11
          arrow-down
          4
          ·
          1 year ago

          “Any dictator would admire the uniformity and obedience of the U.S. media.” - Noam Chomsky