This is a complete tangent, but I work at an office job, where we’re allowed to work remotely, but we meet up in the office typically once or twice a week. And I have this colleague, who decided a few weeks ago to do a work+travel thing, where she stayed in a city at the other side of the country and worked from there for a whole week.
Then we talked about when we should meet up in the office again in the week afterwards, and I suggested Tuesday, so she’d have Monday to kind of recover. As we talked, she mentioned that she would return on Sunday evening and that she had already separately made plans to come in on Monday to meet up with other colleagues, and then for separate organizational reasons, she ended up deciding to also come in on Tuesday.
Like, fuck me, here I am being mindful of her spoons, when she’s more like a bucket chain excavator.
So I work a physical job with mental components. I’m always the lead on a team so this is my job. I have to do a lot of spreadsheet work, emails, teams, etc. Then I have to physically work quite hard most weeks. I often have to travel for work, sometimes many hundreds of miles. If I get lucky I get to fly.
What you posted seems almost like a joke, for real. Monday I have to get up early, rent a U-Haul, go and pick up heavy equipment, transfer a shitload of tools into the rental truck, drive two hours, make nice with everybody at one location, get forms filled out, badging, etc. Then drive another two hours to where I’ll be working Tuesday. I will unload hundreds of pounds of gear, work all day, and reload all that gear that evening. I absolutely have to get Tuesday’s work done or we’re fucked. After I get the test results from my work on Tuesday, I’m going to meet another guy in the middle, 45 minutes each way, and give him the testing equipment. Then I’ll be driving another two hours back to the original site. On Wednesday I’ll be unloading the gear again, and I can start the primary job.
When I see someone saying oh no she had to get in on Sunday night, then come to work for two days it’s a fucking joke.
What I’m saying is that I have chronic fatigue+pain and I’d be on a solid 9 out of 10 on the pain scale for the whole of Monday. I would be genuinely worried that I’d pass out from pain at some point. I cannot even process what it would do to me, to try to also come in on Tuesday. That’s why I completely misjudged how difficult this would be for her, even though I was aware that she’s healthy. I just assumed even healthy people would run out of steam, if they’re doing things multiple days in a row.
If your levels of health allow you to work that job, then check your goddamn privilege honestly good for you.
I was aware of what community I’m in but I assumed you were describing a healthy person. Which ended up being true but I didn’t take it from your perspective.
I’m generally physically healthy but not mentally. I’m on several medications for my mental health. I have to bring myself to what feels like death to me, from exhaustion some weeks, some are not so bad.
It’s a way chronically ill people talk about energy.
Our bodies tend not to be as resilient as healthy people. So if we do too much (ie. use too many spoons), instead of recovering after a day or two like healthy people would if they did too much, we tend to have our health worsen for long periods.
So the analogy is you have a limited number of “spoons” (energy) each day, and you have to use it wisely.
Obviously, this doesn’t impact every disability and is mostly used by chronically ill people and people with energy limiting conditions.
While I love spoon theory I think it’s a poor metaphor to use for general audiences as it requires a lot of context. I guess this tweet is not really targeted at everyone, but just a rant to their circle.
Neither of those terms are quite interchangeable though. Everybody has low energy days, that’s relatively normal. But the word spoons is a shorthand for explaining a precious, and much more finite resource, as a way to distinguish the experience for disabled people.
I’m sorry, are you trying to argue that spoons aren’t a vital, nor precious, resource for disabled people? Because I disagree vehemently. Please go and read Christine Miserandino’s original post:
I never heard of it before and while I did not immediately fully understand it, I did understand and empathize with its point. I guess what I am saying is this is an anecdotal story that supports your argument.
A bucket full of a liquid. That bucket has a faucet over top of it that fills it at x rate constantly. For disabled people it fills more slowly than normal abled people so pouring energy out is more costly timewise and must be calculated carefully.
While I do like this metaphor, I think it’s not useful as a shorthand. Once you explain spoons to people in your life, and they understand, it’s a useful tool to catch their attention and help them realise that energy isn’t an abundant resource for you.
If the original tweet was for the general audience, just replace with “energy”. That’s it. The term is more understood in our bubble only. You are suffering from bias.
Jargon is usually used to make oneself feel “in”, but it by design excludes everyone else from the conversation.
I come from a mental health background and spoons is excellent for anyone. It needs explaining, sure, but neurodivergent people can use spoons to explain the cost of their executive dysfunction, people with depression can use spoons… hell, people free from illness can use this expression, too!
I get being bitter about jargon but it’s an extremely versatile and easy-to-understand metaphor. I think the aim here should be to share it more, rather than try to label it as improper to include.
I get that spoons are a tangable and limited resource, and that part provides for a better example. But the part that doesn’t work well is that spoons have a specific value and use case. Like, you could still operate pretty normally without a spoon.
“spoons”? This might be a term I’m not familiar with…
You’ve already gotten some other good answers, but here’s the original post by Christine Miserandino who coined the term: https://butyoudontlooksick.com/articles/written-by-christine/the-spoon-theory/
I’m very familiar with the concept but I had never seen the origin of spoon theory. Holy shit is that powerful
This is a complete tangent, but I work at an office job, where we’re allowed to work remotely, but we meet up in the office typically once or twice a week. And I have this colleague, who decided a few weeks ago to do a work+travel thing, where she stayed in a city at the other side of the country and worked from there for a whole week.
Then we talked about when we should meet up in the office again in the week afterwards, and I suggested Tuesday, so she’d have Monday to kind of recover. As we talked, she mentioned that she would return on Sunday evening and that she had already separately made plans to come in on Monday to meet up with other colleagues, and then for separate organizational reasons, she ended up deciding to also come in on Tuesday.
Like, fuck me, here I am being mindful of her spoons, when she’s more like a bucket chain excavator.
So I work a physical job with mental components. I’m always the lead on a team so this is my job. I have to do a lot of spreadsheet work, emails, teams, etc. Then I have to physically work quite hard most weeks. I often have to travel for work, sometimes many hundreds of miles. If I get lucky I get to fly.
What you posted seems almost like a joke, for real. Monday I have to get up early, rent a U-Haul, go and pick up heavy equipment, transfer a shitload of tools into the rental truck, drive two hours, make nice with everybody at one location, get forms filled out, badging, etc. Then drive another two hours to where I’ll be working Tuesday. I will unload hundreds of pounds of gear, work all day, and reload all that gear that evening. I absolutely have to get Tuesday’s work done or we’re fucked. After I get the test results from my work on Tuesday, I’m going to meet another guy in the middle, 45 minutes each way, and give him the testing equipment. Then I’ll be driving another two hours back to the original site. On Wednesday I’ll be unloading the gear again, and I can start the primary job.
When I see someone saying oh no she had to get in on Sunday night, then come to work for two days it’s a fucking joke.
Check your goddamn privilege.
What I’m saying is that I have chronic fatigue+pain and I’d be on a solid 9 out of 10 on the pain scale for the whole of Monday. I would be genuinely worried that I’d pass out from pain at some point. I cannot even process what it would do to me, to try to also come in on Tuesday. That’s why I completely misjudged how difficult this would be for her, even though I was aware that she’s healthy. I just assumed even healthy people would run out of steam, if they’re doing things multiple days in a row.
If your levels of health allow you to work that job, then
check your goddamn privilegehonestly good for you.Hey, I’m sorry.
I was aware of what community I’m in but I assumed you were describing a healthy person. Which ended up being true but I didn’t take it from your perspective.
I’m generally physically healthy but not mentally. I’m on several medications for my mental health. I have to bring myself to what feels like death to me, from exhaustion some weeks, some are not so bad.
Thank you for sharing.
It’s a way chronically ill people talk about energy.
Our bodies tend not to be as resilient as healthy people. So if we do too much (ie. use too many spoons), instead of recovering after a day or two like healthy people would if they did too much, we tend to have our health worsen for long periods.
So the analogy is you have a limited number of “spoons” (energy) each day, and you have to use it wisely.
Obviously, this doesn’t impact every disability and is mostly used by chronically ill people and people with energy limiting conditions.
While I love spoon theory I think it’s a poor metaphor to use for general audiences as it requires a lot of context. I guess this tweet is not really targeted at everyone, but just a rant to their circle.
What metaphor would you suggest instead? At least in my experience, the term is becoming understood more and more by the mainstream.
Could’ve just said effort or energy and i would’ve understood the intent of this post, I am now clued into spoon theory now though
Neither of those terms are quite interchangeable though. Everybody has low energy days, that’s relatively normal. But the word spoons is a shorthand for explaining a precious, and much more finite resource, as a way to distinguish the experience for disabled people.
But it’s not a vital nor precious resource. It’s just tangable and limited. I think that’s the disconnect.
I’m sorry, are you trying to argue that spoons aren’t a vital, nor precious, resource for disabled people? Because I disagree vehemently. Please go and read Christine Miserandino’s original post:
https://butyoudontlooksick.com/articles/written-by-christine/the-spoon-theory/
I did, and the point was about general translation.
I never heard of it before and while I did not immediately fully understand it, I did understand and empathize with its point. I guess what I am saying is this is an anecdotal story that supports your argument.
A bucket full of a liquid. That bucket has a faucet over top of it that fills it at x rate constantly. For disabled people it fills more slowly than normal abled people so pouring energy out is more costly timewise and must be calculated carefully.
While I do like this metaphor, I think it’s not useful as a shorthand. Once you explain spoons to people in your life, and they understand, it’s a useful tool to catch their attention and help them realise that energy isn’t an abundant resource for you.
If the original tweet was for the general audience, just replace with “energy”. That’s it. The term is more understood in our bubble only. You are suffering from bias.
Jargon is usually used to make oneself feel “in”, but it by design excludes everyone else from the conversation.
I come from a mental health background and spoons is excellent for anyone. It needs explaining, sure, but neurodivergent people can use spoons to explain the cost of their executive dysfunction, people with depression can use spoons… hell, people free from illness can use this expression, too!
I get being bitter about jargon but it’s an extremely versatile and easy-to-understand metaphor. I think the aim here should be to share it more, rather than try to label it as improper to include.
Yes, if you have the chance to explain. If you can’t, talking about spoons just confuses people.
I get that spoons are a tangable and limited resource, and that part provides for a better example. But the part that doesn’t work well is that spoons have a specific value and use case. Like, you could still operate pretty normally without a spoon.
Go read the origin post I commented elsewhere in this thread. I think it helps explain why “energy” doesn’t work as well.
First I’ve heard of it
Spoons are a common metaphor for effort or energy.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spoon_theory