Title is the epiphany. Story as follows:
There’s a fairly new neighbour that has moved in next to me. They are outgoing and extroverted in that needy or demanding way whereas for me as an autistic person, I’m much more self-contained and don’t seek out idle chit-chat with acquaintances because I honestly don’t need it in my life and I don’t reap any benefit from it.
Anyway, there has been a few odd conversational topics that have arisen multiple times over the course of our interactions and with one of them it got to the point where I’ve thought to myself “What the fuck is up with their preoccupation with this topic? I’m sick of talking about this.” and, upon reflection, I realised that they were insinuating themselves into a situation that they are completely oblivious to, that isn’t their business, and that isn’t a concern whatsoever.
I don’t want to explain exactly what it is because it’s pretty identifying info but think along the lines of someone “casually” mentioning that the soil your cacti are living in is very dry - yeah it really is, what of it?
Anyway once the penny had (finally) dropped for me that this person doing that weird Boomerish thing where they repeatedly drop mention of something like how nice the weather is today and they expect that you’re going to understand that they’re trying to suggest that you should mow the lawn today (a legit post that someone made on social media but maybe it was about mowing the lawn or maybe it was about putting the washing out - I forget the specifics), I turned this over in my mind and came to the conclusion in the post title above:
They are literally treating interactions with me like it’s a chess match. They are making conversational manoeuvres in an attempt to force a particular response out of me. You don’t do that sort of thing with a person unless you see them as an adversary. If you are gonna treat me like an adversary then we are not friends and I have no obligation to extend my goodwill towards you.
(On a tangent, this is the reason why I have a strong dislike of the Socratic Method - because it essentially treats people as your conversational adversaries.)
This is the newest development in my experience of unmasking and growing beyond my people-pleasing so I thought I would share this realisation with others.
They are literally treating interactions with me like it’s a chess match.
You might be looking too deeply into this, some people just use more contextual language without putting any higher level thought into it or gaming out how the conversation will flow based beforehand or anything.
eg, there’s a variety of apple my sister uses for pie, my mom won’t see any difference between “Please make an apple pie for thanksgiving.” and “There’s a bag of apples in the kitchen.”
It came up at work a few times where instead of “Can you do X by <date>?”, you’d get a bunch of information related to the task and what other people are doing, expecting you to go “Oh yeah, I’ll have X done by <date>”.
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You know, reading the title, I thought this was referring to your behavior and thought of things I should watch out for before I even read the rest of your post.
That’s a really insightful way of looking at interactions with people who do take on manipulative angles.
As a person being subjected to manipulative tactics, I can see how you’re right about the impossibility of genuine connection when someone has an angle. I can’t connect with someone who is trying to communicate with me as though there are winners and losers. Especially when there are hidden motives. It’s even worse when I’m pretty agreeable even when I’m not people -pleasing. You ask me to do something and it doesn’t hurt me, I happily do it.
As someone who’s had to be tactical and manipulative to navigate around abusive people, that genuine connection is still difficult if not impossible. I don’t see it as malicious as the former example because I did it more out of fear, but the results are almost identical. I can’t be fully connected in friendship or more if I’m afraid of losing or people pleasing to avoid rejection.
For me, a lot of my navigation comes from a mix of trauma and the way I first approached my neurodiversity. It was only recently that i started unpacking the ways I masked and avoided conflicts. I was really honest growing up and that wasn’t welcome when my family was trying to project an air of normalcy. I lied to my family because telling the truth wasn’t worth the disruption it caused. I ended up bringing that mentality into other relationships where I thought you spared people your honest feelings because it would be an imposition.
Looking back, I can remember tips and strategies my parents would give for navigating people like, “if someone asks you what you’re doing later today, be vague so you can bow out of doing them a favor if they ask.”
The strategies worked to a point when I wanted to get away from people who were not reasonable, but it’s made it hard for me to connect when I come into conflict. Saying no is still hard for me, but I think your framing of an adversary in a chess game will help figure out what mindset I’m using in an interaction. It could give me enough pause to see if I want the person in my life or if I’m feeling anxious for some reason.
Thanks!
Thanks for your reply.
I think you’re striking upon the other side of this epiphany here which I didn’t explain because it’s a bit complicated and more of a personal thing to me but as a person who experienced a really abusive childhood if I find myself reverting to a style of communication that feels like I’m the one who is playing a game of chess then that’s a really good indicator that I’m feeling unsafe and that there are power dynamics which are out of whack.
That’s not to say that this is clear proof that I’m being abused or manipulated but if my instictive behavioural response is to carefully calculate the way that I communicate with a person then I need to start recognising that as a clear sign that I’m not feeling a sufficient level of safety, comfort, or trust in that relationship.
if my instictive behavioural response is to carefully calculate the way that I communicate with a person then I need to start recognising that as a clear sign that I’m not feeling a sufficient level of safety, comfort, or trust in that relationship.
🤯
Are we really not supposed to be doing the careful calculation thing, because haha…
That’s what I’m noticing exactly - when I notice others doing it, I know I’m not getting genuine connection and I need to evaluate if they are uncomfortable or being passive aggressive.
When I notice I’m doing it, I know I’m either feeling unsafe, uncomfortable, or somehow on the defensive. In that sense, I need to step back and reevaluate before I try to ‘win’ however that ends up looking.
They are literally treating interactions with me like it’s a chess match. They are making conversational manoeuvres in an attempt to force a particular response out of me. You don’t do that sort of thing with a person unless you see them as an adversary.
A charitable interpretation of this is that they see something they think you should do (water your cactus), or maybe even want you to do (mow your lawn), but they understand it’s not their place to request you do anything, and/or understand that you may have a different perspective on how to handle whatever it is. Whether that charitable interpretation is warranted is something you’d have the best information on.
“I’m trying to get this person to do something” isn’t strictly an adversarial posture, too, especially if the person isn’t really trying to twist your arm.
It’s not that adversarial, I’ve had this conversation with someone at work - they read masses more information into statements and context than we do. One of my coworkers thought there was some sort of drama going on between me and the boss’s wife because of an offhand comment I made, and I had to explain that I literally only meant the words that I’d used and they didn’t carry any additional insinuations. Similarly, I miss a lot of the information she thinks she’s giving me when we chat, but it’s mostly gossip and small talk so I don’t really care that I don’t understand.
My boss used to do it a lot, but I generally look at him like he just said the moon tastes like curtains until he explains what he actually means.
