At the top should be “1991-2001 Ukraine must give Russia it’s nuclear missiles or they can no longer be friends, if they do give them, Russia will recognize Ukraine as an independent state and soverignty over its borders”
1991 - 2001 Ukraine gives russia all of its nuclear arsenal.
2014 - Russia invades Ukraine anyway, attempts to “anonymize” its soldiers, when caught declares them on holiday and not under its juristiction, meanwhile proclaims captured territories and population as Russian.
2022 - Russia starts a full scale invasion of Ukraine, declaring Ukraine as a country never existed, it’s always been part of Russia. Starts abducting and brainwashing children, replaces original populace in captured areas with Russians, and expedites new Russian passports for the rest.
Somewhere in there there might still be reasoning towards a red line, but I lost track of it :-D
i want to thank the internet minds (maybe OP or whoever made this) for breaking down military strategy in a way i can almost understand <3 keep doing what you do across the board because im lowkey not smart lol
I can see why people are starting to get a little more concerned with regards to western retaliation, given that there aren’t many more steps that can be taken before NATO finally bite the bullet, bring Ukraine into the fold, and formally enter the conflict.
It feels like there’s a game of chicken being played by all sides, all while Ukraine lose lives and land.
What surprises me is the lack of opposition that Putin seems to have. Close to a million Russian lives are lost, their economy is crumbling, yet no one seems to think of officially or unofficially offering a way out for the Russians. While Russia is arguably at the point of no return, a new leader could pull out immediately, rebuild relationships with the west, and transform an economy overnight. All they need to do, at a high level, is not be such a cunt.
Thesr kind of regimes are in a state of constant implosion because they can’t trust each others.
The only thing that stops them from collapsing is the outward pressure of being disappeared without being able to trust anyone else.
Challenging the status quo to them is basically suicide.
Eventually many loyal disappear and are replaced with new members. This new layer is consumed at a very fast rate but still takes a while to disappear
The only way it collapses is when the center concentrates so much power, without needing to disappear anyone because all possible traitors are gone, that is akin to an iron fist.
That’s when the upper layers start collapsing on the core
what is this meant to imply? that Russia has never done anything?
Meanwhile Moscow occupies more than 20% of Ukrainian territory.
This proxy war is a very obvious failure.
Who do you think started the war lmao?
Yes, the 3 day military operation was a failure :)
It’s never too late to rejoin reality.
Ukraine front could ‘collapse’ as Russia gains accelerate, experts warn
You didn’t answer the question.
NATO expansion has no consequences right?
ok tankie
Putin invading neutral countries proves that remaining neutral is stupid, and they should join NATO.
What expansion? The last two countries joined as result of Russian aggression. The ones before joined because they themselves had experienced that only the membership in a strong alliance can potentially safe them from annexation (Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Poland [the last after a deal with literally Hitler]). And once again tell me, why would anyone be afraid of a defensive alliance growing when you don’t intend to invade said countries?
Don’t want to invade your neighbour? Then their NATo-membership is not a problem, hell how about trying to join yourselves?
What expansion?
why would anyone be afraid of a defensive alliance growing
how about trying to join yourselves
You went full circle jerk implying no expansion exists, but then immediately contradicting yourself.
Where is the contradiction?
What expansion?
Doubting the expansion of NATO.
Why would anyone be afraid of a defensive alliance growing?
Hypothetical question after which context is provided, “when you don’t want to invade them?” Asking a hypothetical question is not contradictory to doubting the expansion.
How about trying to join yourself?
I don’t understand why you quoted that.
The point is not to hold more Russian land than Russia holds Ukrainian land (lmao). It’s to deplete their reserves and destroy their economy - which has been working out well, all things considered. You can regain every meter of occupied territory without firing a shot if the Russian state is brought to its knees.
The same talking points (propaganda) that falsely predicted a Russian economic collapse within moments of western sanctions when the war started years ago.
the Russian state is brought to its knees.
Imagine not being a simp to western hegemony and not wanting humans to suffer in any country.
that falsely predicted a Russian economic collapse within moments of western sanctions
Nobody predicted an immediate collapse. Stop making things up. One look at Russia’s economy shows that the sanctions are highly effective nonetheless.
Imagine not being a simp to western hegemony and not wanting humans to suffer in any country.
Imagine being a simp for a mafia state run by the richest man on the planet hellbent on destroying a sovereign nation at the cost of his own people. Doesn’t get much shittier than this, doesn’t it?
Nobody predicted an immediate collapse.
I can safely dismiss your opinions now.
Let’s be real, here. You automatically dismiss all opinions not fed to you by an autocrat.
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Fucking troll.
Putin said he was gonna roll over Ukraine, and we all thought he was gonna roll over Ukraine.
What has been shown is that Putin and his war machine is a fuckin bitch.
Ukraine has been going toe to toe with Russia for fucking years now.
Sure Ukraine has been propped up, but Russian has had to empty prisons and make deals with Iran and North Korea for military aid. Talk about the Axis of evil clowns.
I have almost no respect for Russian leadership. Almost less respect than I do for my next president.
What it has been is a failure to convince smaller nations that they don’t need nukes. Great job everyone.
no, that’s been working out just fine, the question is wether it was a good thing
spoiler
it wasn’t
Something has gone wonky with my internal parser. Can’t figure out what point you’re making. Might double back after another coffee, but I’d appreciate if you could clarify?
I mean robbing smaller countries of their nukes has been working great, I just consider it a bad thing
Cheers yeah same page
It’s not a proxy war if the primary aggressor is the great power - that’s just a war of aggression
Imagine thinking you can singlehandedly redefine proxy wars to fit your narrow definition.
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[Sorry, you just committed an act of Wrongthink™. Currently supporting Nato, western expansion, and Neoliberalism are the Popular and Correct Opinions™. Continued offences will result in being labeled a Russian bot by smug white Liberals.]
Western expansion is when Russia expands westward and performs genocide on Ukrainians, huh?
Its when we put missles near moscow, overthrow nearby governments (color revolutions), and then get shocked when that leads to war. Im not saying its justified but its not shocking either, imagine if china overthrew the Canadian government and started shipping them weapons.
That’s a very reductive description of the orange revolution and euromaidan, though.
In both cases, the US didn’t come in and overthrow the Ukrainian government, there was no assassination, no military coup. At a stretch the most you could reasonably argue the US was involved was egging them on.
It was just an enormous number of Ukrainians protesting the abuse of their political system.
The first time, because the president ordered the kidnapping of a journalist ON VIDEO (whose body was then found, decapitated) then attempted to rig the election in favour of his successor - this resulted in massive protests until the election was re-run (this time with international observers) at the demand of their own supreme court.
The latter because the president ran on a platform of EU alignment, then immediately betrayed the people who elected him by doing the exact opposite in order to placate Russia. He was then removed by parliament, who had a legal right to do exactly that.
Note how, both times, the government was removed, not by a couple, but by the legitimate political institutions of the country.
Its when we put missles near moscow,
The Cold War has been over for some thirty fucking years.
overthrow nearby governments (color revolutions)
Jesus fucking Christ.
