• Juice@midwest.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        39 minutes ago

        Get organized with a progressive or socialist organization. DSA, PSL, or just you and some homes. If you’re completely isolated, an org like DSA is good because they have a lot of “at large” members that aren’t in formal chapters, but at large members have access to national resources too (not in day 1, its a political org, but DSA is good for at large membership). But the people who seem “the most organized” in your area, who have good politics and active membership, is the best org for you to join since these things can vary drastically from place to place.

        From there, get involved in local labor organizing, your group might even have like a labor group that focuses on it.

        If you live in a place where you can get a job that is a part of UAW Union, you can try to get it and “salt”, which means adding radical militant labor organizers to existing stagnant or bureaucratic unions, and start mobilization campaigns.

        A pretty easy thing that would be super helpful, would be to fundraise for materials to create “strike-ready” kits, basically 5 gal bucket and lid full of supplies for an extended period, since strikes are long, difficult, protracted affairs. People get hungry, they get cold and wet, etc., mutual aid has a very low barrier to entry. I’m not a mutual aidist, but its something you could start basically today and have a bunch ready by that time.

        If you can, don’t go alone, bring like minded people in or find like minded people. The best individual thing you can do is to educate yourself so when the time comes you can educate others. Read! Class Struggle Unionism is a classic, but there are probably books about UAW specifically. Another favorite of mine is “Teamster’s Rebellion” if you can find it

    • nomy@lemmy.zip
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 hour ago

      Start saving now, start learning how to fix things, grow food, make do with less.

      A whole lot of people may not have any choice about going without pay for awhile, much less one day, the time to start preparing is now. I tell people as often as I can, especially my trans and bipoc friends; now is the time. Get a couple guns (a long one and a short one) and learn how to use them. Learn some basic first aid, you really just need to know how to stabilize someone. Start networking with like-minded people in your communities, learn how to to grow food and repair things.

      The police will not protect us, they’ve proven they’ll happily club senior citizens to the ground and shoot any protesters in the face with rubber bullets while escorting a rightwing murderer to safety. Iran was a secular, liberal state until almost 1980 when they (mostly legitimately) elected an Islamist theocracy; it could happen here.

      • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        37 minutes ago

        Get a couple guns (a long one and a short one) and learn how to use them.

        This is a pretty intense topic to get involved with.

        I dithered a little bit about getting a firearm. I still do not have one. I know how to use them, in a cursory kind of way.

        Part of why I’ve held back on getting one is this: Imagine playing a board game for the first time, and if you lose, you’re going to die. Or sitting down at a poker table to play for the first time in your life. How well are you going to play? Are you probably going to win? Also, the game only lasts for fifteen seconds.

        Having a gun sounds like not a bad idea for what’s coming up in this country. Having a gun and no experience at all in the types of situations you might get yourself into, if you have a gun, sounds almost worse than just not having one. People freak out, they fuck up, they take the wrong decisions. It’s what naturally happens when you’re playing an adversarial game for the first time in your life. After a while, you learn the game, and you start making generally good decisions a lot more of the time. But the first time…

        I’m not saying having a gun is a bad idea. There are days when I think I’m being stupid for not having one. But also, you need to know what you’re doing, and if you don’t have some kind of military or other professional training, you’re not going to know what you’re doing, and you can walk yourself into situations there’s no good way out of if you don’t know what you’re doing.

  • minnow@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    83
    arrow-down
    5
    ·
    12 hours ago

    A strike that has a scheduled end date is a strike that’s has scheduled its own failure. A ten day strike would achieve nothing except the suffering of it’s participants.

    Yes, the economy would grind to a halt, yes people would likely die, yes it would financially hurt the powerful people in charge.

    But do you really think those powerful people will give a shit? They know after ten days the gravy train will resume, but only for them and not the people who lost their jobs, got arrested, were injured, etc. The rich and powerful can afford to be patient, meanwhile everyone who sacrificed for ten days is going to have to question whether they can survive doing it again.

    No, we’re way past the point where our society can afford another failed effort to affect change. We need a general strike that doesn’t end until the government capitulates to the needs of the people. It’s all or nothing, now. ☹️

    • SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      5 minutes ago

      The strike is not the end of the exercise, oh, no! To pull off a huge action like this will take coordination, spreading awareness, cultivating relationships of trust, establishing lines of communication, laying the foundations by organizing, and getting people primed for action. That’s what we lack now.

      Right now, we could all just choose to disobey together, and there are so many of us that they couldn’t stop us. But it would take a lot of people; only a few here and there taking action would simply leave those few destitute or in jail.

      A general strike is not the goal, it’s the announcement that we’re organized. That awareness, those relationships, that trust, doesn’t just have to go away…

    • rayyy@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      edit-2
      2 hours ago

      We need a general strike that doesn’t end until the government capitulates to the needs of the people

      Many cannot afford to strike but that is the way the system was set however we only need 10% participation to send a powerful message - any more is icing on the cake. Those who cannot fully can participate by cutting back 10% or more. Everyone should be able to cut back to some extent. Yet, expect the corporate controlled MSM to NOT report on the effects or participation of a general strike. Look for your news on independent sites, some reliable foreign sources and the Fediverse only.

    • db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      14
      ·
      edit-2
      3 hours ago

      That’s not always accurate. A strike where people sit at home and watch TV might have this result, but a 10 days of people on the streets talking and hyping each other up, can easily grow revolutionary, especially if during those 10-days people use direct action for their mutual aid to cover their needs

      1-day strikes and random marches on the other hand are practically useless

    • mm_maybe@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      2 hours ago

      What about canceling a specific day of work every week? That would spread out the pain on both sides, but in a way that makes it less painful for workers because some may have sick days they can use. If literally nobody shows up on every Friday it sucks pretty bad for the bosses, even if they show up all the other days.

  • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    63
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    13 hours ago

    It is both.

    Voting is a good system. The alternative is “let’s just have a fight with guns, or with money, or connections to powerful people, every time there’s a disagreement.”

    The problem is that we delegated the process of informing people what to vote for, to absolutely rotten media. And we delegated the process of figuring out the details of putting some candidates forward, to an absolutely craven, useless, and corrupt class of full-time political operatives who generally don’t give a shit about the people.

    We need to fix those things. And yes, getting organized labor to fight back whenever they are fucking us, which is pretty much every day, to add some bite to all those polite ballots we’re sending in, sounds great.

    But voting, as a concept, is good. It doesn’t have to be either or. It can be a 10-day general strike, and also voting to get rid of the guy who wants to nuke Iceland, and also organizing our politics better, for some candidates that aren’t so shit as these ones generally are. Each one will help the others get done.

    • mm_maybe@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      2 hours ago

      There is also the issue of massive-scale gerrymandering, party politics preventing candidates we want from being given a chance to run in general elections, the electoral college, and widespread voter suppression and disenfranchisement as well-documented by Greg Palast and others. If they actually counted our votes we might get a more representative democracy, but what we have now is not that.

      • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        2 hours ago

        Yeah. That’s why I agree with the general strike. Like I say, we’ve delegated the details of wielding political details to a whole class of exclusively-political people, and they’ve been rigging the game and keeping all the power for themselves. Fuck that.

    • Prunebutt@slrpnk.net
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      9 hours ago

      I think you’re opening up a false dichotomy here: it’s not about voting vs. the law of the fist. It’s about how the democratic systems are set up to keep the powerful in power.

      The system is set up to promote those “absolutely craven, useless, and corrupt class of full-time political operatives who generally don’t give a shit about the people”. And “fixing” the media to not promote those things is like trying to teach a cat not to hunt mice.

      There are more ways to have a democratic stucture of politics than “we decide onsour ruler every four years”.

      • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        3
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        3 hours ago

        “We need both” “It doesn’t have to be either or”

        “I think you’re opening up a false dichotomy here”

        • Prunebutt@slrpnk.net
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          3 hours ago

          Voting is a good system. The alternative is “let’s just have a fight with guns, or with money, or connections to powerful people, every time there’s a disagreement.”

          Show me how this is not a dichotomy. Why are these the only options?

          • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            3 hours ago

            Discussing why not having voting invites other methods of deciding power struggles that are even less democratic, does not mean a false dichotomy. I am very clearly discussing why both voting and also using other means of people power, together, is the way.

            What do you think is my main argument? If not that both together are the way?

            • Prunebutt@slrpnk.net
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              3 hours ago

              Discussing why not having voting invites other methods of deciding power struggles that are even less democratic, does not mean a false dichotomy

              Yes it is. It presupposes that parliamentary democracy is the only way of democratic governance.

              You are literally demonstrating the effect of the media landscape that you’re criticizing: you’re acting like there’s no other democratic alternative than a parliamentary democracy.

              • PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                3 hours ago

                Tell you what: Tell me more about the other democratic alternatives you say I am missing. I didn’t think that my examples at all presupposed the existence of a parliamentary democracy, but if I know more about your counterexamples, I can better make sense of whether or not I overlooked them.

                • Prunebutt@slrpnk.net
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  3 hours ago

                  While I don’t have a perfect plan on democratic governance (sorry, I’m just a small, little boi), these examples came to mind right away:

                  What I also want to adress is that the things you’re criticizing in your first comment are structural problems of a liberal democracy. That means that they don’t stem from bad actors inside the system, but rather from the way the system is set up. Members of parliament have a free mandate and are under no direct obligation to enact policies on which they ran in elections. Yes, they can not get elected the next term, but this can also be an incentive to “get away with it” by e.g. manipulating the media landscape, lying, covering your tracks, searching for excuses, etc.

                  Also: you canwt vote the system away. When you’re voting, the only available opitions are ones that stabilize the parliamentary system. That’s why I don’t (or at least not completely) agree with “it needs both”. A general strike could lead to a more democratic system, while electoralism will always try to strengthen the current system.

    • NateNate60@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      10
      ·
      12 hours ago

      The media will always exist and people will always base their decisions on the information they receive in the media. This is inevitable in any society with the degree of complexity we have today. It is just not possible to gather all the information ourselves about any but the most personal of topics. That is why free, unbiased, and independent media is an extremely important part of liberal electoral democracy. And for the greater part of the past two centuries, this is what we more or less had. Yes, major media outlets have always been somewhat controlled by the upper class (whether in the form of media companies or local media magnates), but until quite recently, most of them didn’t care about using those outlets as propaganda pieces; they just cared about continuing to collect their subscription money, which is likely the best-case scenario for privately owned for-profit media. It is astonishing that this system lasted as long as it did.

      • SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        11 hours ago

        There used to be a requirement of giving equal air time to opposing opinions - that was one of the earlier things Republicans successfully targeted. I’ve no idea how to make that work with the virtually unlimited possible sources available today.

        • Prunebutt@slrpnk.net
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          6
          ·
          9 hours ago

          That just opens you up to false balancing. See: the media landscape on climate change for the last 70 years.

          • DeeDan06@lemmy.dbzer0.com
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            ·
            8 hours ago

            And also only works when there are only two sides to represent to begin with, so it would reinforce the two party system

  • PugJesus@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    25
    ·
    13 hours ago

    Electoral politics doesn’t get the job done, but failing to attend to electoral politics can sure as shit make the job harder.

    The question of “Who are we negotiating with” is all-important in every scenario except “Complete and total unconditional victory”.

    • nickwitha_k (he/him)@lemmy.sdf.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      6
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      12 hours ago

      Failing to attend to electoral politics is also a great way to ensure that blood has to be spilled again to re-win battles that were already fought, as has been seen with many of those left of center sitting out elections for half a century, which just so happens to coincidence with decoupling of wages from productivity, increasing wealth inequality, and erosion of workers’ rights.

      If I thought people were consistent enough, I’d say that the founding of anti-electoralism was a right-wing, authoritarian conspiracy, but I don’t think that’s super likely.

    • miscellanii@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      21
      ·
      13 hours ago

      This is what bothers me so much about the constant calls for general strikes on social media. They’re almost never paired with serious organization (ex: where are the strike funds to support people who otherwise can’t afford to miss paychecks?)

      • bassomitron@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        8
        ·
        12 hours ago

        Not to mention a large chunk of the public won’t agree with the idea to begin with. Especially the top 20-30% of income earners.

        Additionally, emergency/medical personnel not working would mean people are directly dying as a result of it, creating easy negative PR against the movement.

        Asking 180+ million people to coordinate on anything is a farce, and for something like a general strike it is an absolute fantasy.

      • aubeynarf@lemmynsfw.com
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        8
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        12 hours ago

        Have you noticed they’re always paired with messages encouraging voter apathy and disparticipation ?

    • Tasty Saganaki@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      ·
      12 hours ago

      We’re in a country with very little organized labor compared to other countries in Europe or Latin America where strikes are common. Also cops here are highly militarized. Plus we are a massive country. Still, I think Americans need to consider a general strike and organize if need be. Is it easy? Obviously not. But I’ll happily take some optimism in these dark times.