Switch going to be conservative, meanwhile the deck clones are going all out. Wonder how those will run switch 2 emulators.
Kind of tangential, but can you do local multiplayer when emulating the switch on a steam deck. Like can you have a 4 player Mario kart game?
Sure. Just need to use some external controllers obviously.
It probably won’t work to do local multiplayer with multiple consoles easily.
Ryujinx has an LDN build for that.
They’ve had LDN in the main build for a while now, I wouldn’t advise using that dedicated LDN build, it’s quite old and hasn’t been updated. The standard one has LDN in the settings under the network tab.
Image of said page
I don’t see why you couldn’t. Just connect multiple controllers and configure accordingly.
I regularly emulate Switch games on my RoG Ally Z1E, and it pulls it off so fucking well, I haven’t touched my Switch since I got the thing (it easily runs every title I’ve thrown at it at 60fps+higher res, plus I have the ability to mod games if I need to.)
I can’t imagine it’ll be too difficult for them to emulate Switch 2 games, assuming Nintendo don’t catch on to emulation developers too early.
They will probably use some version of DLSS that’s hard to emulate.
Emulators will just run at higher resolutions instead of blurry upscaling anyway.
Then we just disable it, and run the DLSS natively.
If it’s possible, it might be some proprietary version that games can’t run without.
Honestly I’ll “take” a low power switch 2 with the expectation of eventually emulating it with enhancements.
Wonder how those will run switch 2 emulators.
Well, considering Nintendo is on a war path and legally threatening emulator devs, I doubt anyone will even attempt a Switch 2 emulator.
I’d put everything I own and my literal life betting someone will make one. It’s happened for literally everything else, the switch 2 won’t be different.
Would be hard going after devs that don’t blatantly make money off it like Yuzu did. Would also be pretty hard going after anonymous devs not using US based version control or just private. Lot of countries don’t care about DMCA either. Yuzu was just very stupid but Nintendo in the worst case isn’t all powerful either.
Cemu doesn’t seem to have a problem with profitability. The litigation was about circumvention of encryption and blatant piracy advocation.
You underestimate how masochistic Nintendo fans are.
They will be working, Ninjas be damned.
Yuzu is still going. Shit got forked thousands of times the whole week leading up to the takedown. If the Nintendorks think that shit is dead, they have missed the entire point of open source.
They just made working on Yuzu more annoying, even discord was taking stuff down. But it’s not like discord alternatives like matrix don’t exist. Version control even more so.
I forked it on GitHub, GitLab, two private git servers, and Google Drive lmao. Shit isn’t going anywhere.
Interesting, so in between lawsuits and takedowns they still do game related stuff from time to time huh?
One thing is certain,
due to all those lawsuits and takedowns,
I won’t be buying into their next console,
they won’t get a single dime from me anymore.But who will buy their $70 Wii U/Wii ports? :p
What have they done recently that made you decide not to buy from them, that they haven’t already been doing for 30+ years to begin with? Nintendo’s lawsuits against emulator devs aren’t a new phenomenon; they’ve been shutting down emulator/ROM projects since the 90s.
They might have been doing it for longer then I’ve been aware of.
But this is a (small) list of things that caught my attention and made me despise them:
- Garry’s Mod takedowns
- Yuzu + Citra takedowns
- Relic Castle takedown
- Palworld Mod takedowns
- BOTW Mod takedowns
- PointCrow DMCAs
- Gary Bowser’s life ruined
Nintendo consoles are great for piracy if that’s your bag
Wow, modern technology has really progressed, can’t wait to play tears of the kingdom still at 30 fps
You can already play it comfortably in 60 fps, but not on Nintendo hardware.
Last time they tried a slight upgrade to not rock the boat and maintain backward compatibility was the WiiU.
That was the Wii actually. It being a slightly up clocked Gamecube. The WiiU was a massive hardware upgrade from the Wii at the time. The WiiU just had a host of other problems.
The Wii: Two GameCube glued together with funky remote controllers
The Wii U: Two Wii glued together with a funky remote controller… With a screen!
You can play GameCube games on the Wii U via USB by hacking the Wii part of the console, Nintendo just had a little bit more work to do to make it natively compatible…
Nah, the Wii wasn’t even two GC glued together. It was really just an overlocked GC. When you play GC games on Wii, the hardware clocks down and the Wii becomes a gamecube.
The reason why the Wii U can do that as well, is because in adition to it’s own hardware, all the necessary Wii hardware is also on board. It’s less a Wii mode than a built in Wii.
Eh yes but they really rocked the boat with the Wii going to motion wands and those Wii characters.
The article is “Conservative Hardware Evolution”. Emphasis mine. The Switch2 will also be a conservative hardware evolution, exactly like the Wii. The Wii’s hardware was extremely conservative, already ancient upon release. Rocked 0 boats.
Controllers are hardware too
Nope. Peripherals.
Peripherals are hardware. Hardware literally means “the physical components of an electronic system” and last I checked, you can touch a controller.
The WiiU was one of my favourite consoles.
Probably why they’re going after the emulators. Sounds like this thing is still well within reach of emulation, probably in the first couple of months of release.
I think up until the 3DS, console hardware was still somewhat specialised, to the point where you can’t 100% accurately emulate old cobsoles. But at the level we currently are, consoles a little more than all-purpose computers. Emulating then is only down to having enough computational power.
A lot of old consoles are actually based on standard CPUs for the most part. Look at the history of the 6502 for example. Emulating the hardware can be done if time is taken to reverse engineer all the layers into an emulator.
Part of the issue, to me, can be if all the work is done and then copyright disputes arise- all work has to be removed from the public.
At this point you can write the circuitry in SPICE and the chips in Verilog and simulate the whole old console clock by clock down to the transistor level and still get a playable game out of it
Of course this is only viable until say… before the 3D era or so
If you go old enough, the problem often falls in the imperfections of the tech. When you simulate the whole console perfectly, you are idealizing a system that was far from perfect, and you might miss real features that depended on that.
This gets done with FPGA systems like the MiSTer and there are N64 and PSX Cores for the MiSTer, a Saturn Core is in development.
I can’t wait to see Nintendo’s new underpowered console. I’m sure they won’t completely miss the mark again.
1080p?! We’re living in the future, guys!
Considering all of the PC handhelds being released, 1080p is the best you can really do on a handheld screen with modernish games. Steam Deck is the most successful and it is only 800p. Having a 1440 or 2160 screen would decimate battery with little to no benefit.
That’s my point. Nintendo only about to have a 1080p screen does not seem like as big of a selling point as it would have been say, 7 years ago.
Screen size plays a role
Even if you can put an 8k screen in your 15cm profile. There isn’t any reason to do it
I love the Switch form factor, specifically the detachable controllers. I thought it was idiotic when I first saw the commercials but I love it. I don’t care about AAA graphics on a portable, it is a little baby screen anyway. Cel shading, let’s go, IDGAF.
Unfortunately they are making shitty Zeldas now so I’ll probably not buy this one. If someone makes decent Linux hardware with detachable controllers I’d consider that.
Botw and sequel are critically acclaimed across the board.
Even the soundtrack is not up to par. It’s just a dull game.
I’m sure you and the five other people who agree with you can have a riveting conversation about how wrong the millions of fans are.
We are having a pretty good time in the comments. Maybe you could go hang out with the other people who like dull games instead of being upset here.
Have you tried the new Zelda games.
Yes, BotW. Extremely dull. I want my hookshot back. It would be nice to have larger, more challenging dungeons with unique bosses instead of solving a few puzzles and then beating the shit out of roughly the exact same ghost. Most the quests are “get me 10 items” fetch quests. How much wood did I collect to build that town? That’s not fun. Majority of the content is wandering through scenery with nothing in it, or climbing for several minutes at a time.
Faire enough. Judging by the reception most do like them though.
Botw and totk are my favorite games of all time!!!
Yeah, they do seem to like it. It’s nice to chill but definitely not anywhere near the best Zelda like some people rate it. IDGI.
I think there’s three kinds of Zelda fans:
- New to series with BotW and love open world games
- Like the Zelda brand
- Like the dungeon gameplay loop
The first two seem to like the game, whereas the third… don’t. I’m part of the third. The Zelda gameplay loop has typically been:
- Explore world to find dungeon
- Explore dungeon to find the items - new tool, compass, and map
- Use new tool to solve puzzles, along with some puzzles using older items
- Fight dungeon boss, using the new tool
- Use new tool to find secrets in the overworld
- Go to 1 until item slots are full
- Fight main boss (a form of ganon), which is the most difficult fight in the game
BotW dumbed all of that down and added a lot of grindy mechanics:
- korok seeds
- shrine orbs
- fairy upgrades
- cooking
It’s a completely different game and has just enough overlap with the established formula to disappoint. The older Zelda games don’t have any grindy bits unless you really want some piece of equipment early.
So that’s my take. BotW is a decent game, but it’s my least favorite Zelda game. If it wasn’t branded “Zelda” and hyped so much, I probably wouldn’t have bothered with it. My kids love it though, so there’s that.
Oh, and I finished BotW just before TotK launched (kinda late, I know), and instead of buying TotK, I bought Skyward Sword and Link’s Awakening and absolutely loved them. If Switch 2 has more games with the classic formula, I’ll buy it, otherwise I’ll probably pass.
I loved BoTW and ToTK, but your criticisms are pretty much on point. I’m hoping a future game can combine the sense of exploration of the newer games with the traditional dungeons and bosses of the older games, with Majora’s Mask level side quests please!
Did you like Skyrim?
I didn’t play it. I like the memes tho.
Isn’t that more of a leveling RPG? If I got progressively stronger in BotW instead of just picking up slightly larger weapons I might like it more.
Another problem are that there are like, what, 7 kinds of enemies? Every encampment a small flock of keese, some bokoblins, some lizalfos, a moblin or two. Every situation I just use the same swords and arrows. Surely Skyrim has more varied enemies? If Nintendo are trying to make an expansive game they should put content in it.
That was an issue with Breath of the Wild; the scope of the world is way larger than the scope of the game, so there’s lots of big open empty fields with the occasional collection of slight variations of the same half dozen monsters, and the only thing you will encounter during your adventures are a korok “puzzle” or a shrine. maybe a memory.
I will give Nintendo this: they listened to their fans. Zelda players sometime around Twilight Princess started bemoaning how linear Zelda games have become and the inability to sequence break and wanted more non-linear Zelda games. So they made a non-linear game. And Nintendo, being Japanese and thus congenitally incapable of doing anything halfway, made a game so aggressively open world that it will hold you down, squat over your face and non-linear in your mouth and nose.
They went through so much trouble to make the game as non-linear as possible that - whenever a character lists the four divine beasts, the old or new champions, their races, villages, or biomes therein - it’s never done in the same order twice so as not to suggest a canon completion order.
This prevented them from doing big sweeping stories like the one in Twilight Princess because events could happen out of order or not at all, so the story takes place 100 years in the past and you find out details of it out of order.
Tears of the Kingdom is simply not as good. The story is even thinner on the ground to the point of feeling lazy; the champions plagiarized each other’s cut scenes. It’s outright inconsistent with previous lore, so that’s just a big fuck you to long-term fans of the series. And even if there is a slightly bigger variety in monster types and whatnot, it’s spread across a MUCH larger play area and the sky and depths are full of…mostly nothing.
It feels like every idea anyone suggested during development ended up in the game. There’s not one but two new crafting systems along with the new rune mechanics, and none of it gets a change to breathe. They had enough ideas here to make two games, one that explores the vehicle/robot building mechanics, and one that explores the weapon fusing. Maybe have one feature the sky, and one that features the depths. But no, TotK is a mile wide and an inch deep.
That first reveal commercial, where a guy is on his couch playing BotW, and then he realizes it’s time go go, breaks his controller up, slides the joycons onto the side of the console and then lifts it out of the dock to keep playing on the train? Great.
…Then there’s two solid minutes of what I call “yeah yeah and.” You can put down the kickstand and put it on an airline tray table (which is a lie; the kickstand is extremely far to the side and the universe does not contain a surface the Switch will balance on. Bring your Ryobi 18V hot glue gun I guess). Yeah, yeah, and each joycon can be turned sideways and each becomes its own shitty tiny controller so you can try to play 2 player split screen on a display the size of my tongue. Yeah yeah and you can put the tablet down and play like, chess or some shit across the table from someone. Yeah Yeah And.
Get an Steam Deck lol
Genuinely considering it! If it had some dumb detachable controllers I’d have one already.
I wish Steam actually sold those in the real world. I only hear about them on the internet from Americans. I’ve never seen one in real life. It would be really cool if they were real.
If that’s how the console turns out then I expect them to make up that difference in the cost. I’ll be happy with a modest console as long as it has full backwards compatible and it’s not priced at the steam deck
I too like to buy my hardware solely based on a spec sheet.
I honestly don’t care about “underpowered hardware” and other similar crap. I do care about having to pay a sub just to get cloud saves, Nintendo’s excessively restrictive policies, their obsession with litigating fans, their frustrating inability to understand modern multiplayer, and their increasing desire to rehash the same games many times.
The only reason I owned a Switch was for on-the-go gaming because gaming on phones is a joke, and now I have a Steam Deck.
their obsession with litigating fans
Yeah this is why I’m not a customer of theirs anymore. At this point I’m 100% a PC gamer.
I was gonna say something about needing powerful hardware before I realized the game I was gonna reference as an example was nothing but rushed out code held together by dollar store glue.
This is usually (and sadly) the case.
Man, nintendo just needs to stop. Ugh. “Heres our NEW underperforming console! Get ready to play severely inferior ports of popular 3rd party games, everyone! We’ve ensured that only nintendo games will run well on our new console and nothing else because we dont actually want these vastly superior games from 3rd parties to outclass our nintendo developed games!”. Why is it so hard for them to actually release something that’s is on equal grounds with everything else? They spending all their coin on their precious DMCAs’ or something? Also, fuck nintendo. Fuck them, fuck their inferior hardware and fuck their severe hatred of the fans. Seriously, I’m noticing a trend here. Either you are forced to play their games, which really aren’t THAT great and mostly weird, or you’re forced to play other 3rd party games, select ones at that, with severely inferior standards and performance. It’s like they’re trying to discourage any quality games out there from playing on their hardware on purpose because it’s nintendo games or the highway, and that fits their aggressively anticonsumer mindset too. Another great indicator of this is why they refuse to let their characters appear in Fortnite. The kinda funny podcast did a piece on this. Here’s a shocker: they literally said they don’t want their characters in the game because it wasn’t on their hardware exclusively. How childish is that? They are literally the only ones who won’t do it. Microsoft and Sony were OK with having Kratos, Master Chief, Aloy, etc, DC was cool with sharing their IPs, Marvel was cool with it, MHA, DragonBall, Kaizen, AOT were cool with it, Fox was cool with sharing Family guy, Konami was cool with sharing Snake, Capcom was cool with sharing SF, hell, WE EVEN GOT JACK SKELLINGTON IN IT, but NOPE, Nintendo can’t play nice. Shocking.
Guess what, Nintendo? Due to your outrageous behavior with emulation and lawsuits, along with your stupid takedowns (GMOD NINTENDO? FUCKING GMOD?), or how you ruined a mans life all because he chipped your garbage hardware, including how much you hate your fans who only wanted to celebrate you, I wont be giving you another fucking dime. I was never really much of a pirate, but when it comes to you? I am now. Get FUCKED you anticonsumerist dirtbags.
If a Nintendo console was comparable to other consoles in the same generation, would the games be more fun?
If not, then what’s the point? Many SNES games are more fun than the vast majority of technically superior games out this year.
“They should make the graphics better so… that… the graphics would be better” isn’t a super compelling argument.
My question is “what’s going to make me stop playing my games on the Switch and play them on this instead”.
My concern is that this is going to end up causing library fragmentation like the WiiU and the New 3DS. The Game Boy Color added color to its predecessor, the New 3DS added… slightly faster polygon calculations? I don’t even know. Some games required the better processor but I couldn’t tell you what they did with it. Maybe they just got away with worse optimization.Idk, I’m not saying I care about graphics specifically, just that equal hardware would allow more 3rd party games to utilize it. The thing that is stopping people from enjoying those games on other consoles is money. People don’t want to buy multiple systems. All I’m saying is I think nintendo should make decent hardware so that users can play the 3rd party games they want on their Nintendo system instead of buying at minimum another console.
Buying games on other platforms is so much cheaper that there’s already no reason to buy them on Switch. Games that are $4 on Steam and included with Gamepass/PS+ are $35 on Switch.
Nintendo systems are for Nintendo games.
Equal hardware wouldn’t be portable though.
Ehhh, they could take a few things from the steam deck. If nintendo really wanted to, they could definitely make a portable system with equal hardware.
Equal to the PS5? No. Equal to the Steam deck? Yeah I guess.
I agree with this mostly, but at the same time more powerful hardware lets the devs experiment with more advanced mechanics. For example, ToTK runs pretty hard into switch limitations with its impressive physics. If Nintendo wanted to take that engine even further, they’d likely need a hardware upgrade.
Additionally, more powerful hardware starts putting more demanding mechanics into the realm of possibility for an indie dev team that has neither the time nor the resources to optimize their games at the same level as a big studio.
Nintendo is too Japanese
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The switch is the 3rd best selling console ever. They are clearly doing something right. You’re comparing a portable handheld to PCs and plug-in consoles.
I’m pleased that’s it’s underpowered because it ensures their games perform well on emulators.
If you’re buying a Nintendo console for 3rd party games you’re going about it all wrong tbh
Yeah, that’s true. I just think it’s bullshit how anti consumer they are. Sure, you’re right, but also like really, Nintendo?
I agree completely, especially under the video game preservation viewpoint.
I lost a few DSi games when the store shut down so I only bought switch cartridges. However I haven’t touched it since I got a Steam Deck because I know those games will last
Yeah, I just think it’s just really childish on their part. That entire company is ridiculous, and I’m glad more and more people are starting to realize it each day.
Honestly, i wouldn’t have expect anything different. Any lack of back-compatibility would have been a suicide move.
I hope games will be able to hit 60fps stable or offer some type of 40hz minimums for the higher refresh rate TVs.
Resolution is important, but if the games still perform like they do now, I’d be disappointed.
I think Nintendo will probably try to hit a great pricepoint for parents instead of high performance. The last powerful Nintendo console that I’m aware of was the Gamecube.
The Wii U was technically the most powerful console on the market for a year until the XB1 and PS4 came out.
I am surprised it won’t be more of a hardware improvement since the switch was released in 2017 so there has been a whole lot of new hardware to choose from since then. I would imagine there would be bigger improvements in GPU with the better Radeon offerings.
The problem is that Nintendo wants to be the affordable console parents buy for kids, and if the hardware costs $600 then it won’t be that.
I looked at the Switch price last week and it actually went up since release (in Canada anyway).
Why would you think that? Nintendo has consistently had the weakest console hardware for the last 3 generations of consoles. People buy up anything with the Nintendo brand on it, what incentive do they have to make an actually good product? They already removed themselves from competing with Sony and Microsoft in a move great for their business but abysmal for consumers.
In this thread: completely out of touch gamers shitting on the world’s second best selling console of all time.
In this context “gamers” means “chronically online gamers”. the 3% of people they actually complain about this kind of stuff that would not change anyway
I thought you were exaggerating, and then I scrolled down.
Full backward compatibility is definitely great to see, if it didn’t have it I probably wouldn’t pick it up for a few years
What does that matter when they drip-feed the older games they own? 2 a month!? Virtual Console games that existed on Wii U and 3DS are simply not there…
Honestly, that sounds nice to me.
Is it me or do they always promise backwards compatibility and then find some cockamamie horseshit at the last minute on why it just wasn’t possible. I might be a little scarred from previous promises (not specific to Nintendo).
Wii had backwards compatibility, same with Wii U. Switch couldn’t use disk so it couldn’t be. All the Gameboys had it. Super Nintendo as well. 3Ds and DS had it. Nintendo often do it.
Super Nintendo was not backward compatible.
It “kind of” was with the Super Gameboy allowing for Gameboy games to run on the SNES. Buy yeah, more like a sideways compatibility
The Super Game Boy was just a Game Boy in a different form factor, it did all the work. All the SNES did was provide inputs and output.
And the GameCube compatibility of the Wii was just original GameCube hardware inside of the Wii doing all the work. Same with PS2 hardware inside the PS3.
Having dedicated hardware inside for compatibility is not uncommon
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Yes and no. The latest released Wii (the Wii mini) lost GameCube compatibility due to hardware changes.
But in the Wii and PS3’s case the hardware was included with the console itself. The Super Game Boy was a separate purchase.
Well, and the Gameboy is not the ancestor to the SNES so backwards compatibility is out of the window completely. Yes, I know that the Super Gameboy is only a unfitting contender, that’s why I said “kind of” in my post.
The DS even had backwards compatibility with the GBA. I think it didn’t work with GB/C games though for some reason.
Someone else already pointed out that the Super Nintendo wasn’t backwards compatible. The SNES’ competitor was backwards compatible though – an optional accessory for the Mega Drive/Genesis allowed you to play Master System games!
I think it didn’t work with GB/C games though for some reason.
GBC cartridges require an extra notch that wasn’t included on GBA cartridges. You physically can’t fit a GBC cartridge into a DS without a dremel tool
Would they work if you managed to get them plugged in?
Personally, I’ve never felt the urge to try because it’d ruin a GBC cartridge and my GBA SP still works fine to this day
That’s not the case. GB > GBC > GBA > GBA SP. GC > Wii > Wii U.
Also: GBA > DS (early models), and DS > 3DS
You’re quite right!
I don’t think the SP was a different console though
Yup, just different form factor with a backlight IIRC.
Replace SP with DS. (:
The GBA DS wasn’t a console! /s Haha
