• PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee
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    2 months ago

    Good intentions, implementation, and results here, but seriously folks, think VERY carefully about what you’re doing when you tamper with something someone’s putting in their body.

    Do not try at home to the nth degree.

    • manuallybreathing@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      implying anyone on 4chan gives a shit about consent

      this made me really uncomfortable too, also its extremely fake, you can’t ‘take apart’ a vape juice bottle (theyre a single piece of plastic), and no one on 4chan has a girlfriend (lol)

      • towerful@programming.dev
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        2 months ago

        You can take apart juice bottles.
        The least realistic part is that anon managed to get to and dilute every bottle their gf used.
        Cause if they miss one, their gf is gonna have a serious shock.

        So, lack of consent and extremely controlling?

        • Empricorn@feddit.nl
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          2 months ago

          That’s a very good point. The fictitious gf is the one buying the bottles. So if they are used to 1% nicotine and pick up a regular strength one, they’re going to use it, and immediately notice the difference…

      • H4mi@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        I take apart mine every time I buy one. To add nicotine. Maybe there are different kinds of bottles? I’ve never seen one where the top is not detachable.

      • cosmicrookie@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Maybe the ones you use can’t be taken apart but dont assume the whole world aligns to your image of it

        Just be open to things possibly being different to what you experience them to be

      • Makhno@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        also its extremely fake, you can’t ‘take apart’ a vape juice bottle (theyre a single piece of plastic),

        What sketchy cheap shit are you using? I’ve used a vape for a decade now, and you can remove the nipple cape on every single bottle.

      • uis@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        you can’t ‘take apart’ a vape juice bottle (theyre a single piece of plastic)

        We don’t know anything about that particular bottle OP used.

        • JasonDJ@lemmy.zip
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          2 months ago

          Totally wrong. Most juice comes in squeeze plastic bottles with a little nipple for filling a refillable vape.

          When I was lowering my dose I bought 120ml of my favorite flavors and diluted it down with PG and VG off the shelf.

          Traditionally it’s really just PG (propylene glycol), VG (vegetable glycerin), flavor agents, and nicotine/nicotine salts. Nicotine itself you can buy in gallon form, suspended in PG or VG, at a dilution of 100mg/ml. Unsure on nicotine salts. But just reducing it with PG, VG, or both, is no less safe than the vape itself.

      • TurtlePower@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        You don’t use a random cutting solution, you use the same juice with no nicotine. A lot of juice makers offer 0 nic versions for people that want to just enjoy the act and flavor of vaping without the addiction, and for this specific purpose of cutting the nic level because they only offer certain increments (usually 3%, 6%, 12%), which may be too high for one’s personal preference.

      • gila@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        Just as a thought experiment, what you’d really wanna do is change the salt nic formulation, i.e. the acidic compound which is added to freebase nicotine to convert it to a salt. This directly shapes the pharmacokinetics of the resulting nicotinic effect from vaping it, which is what leads to the common knowledge that salt nic hits harder, but doesn’t last as long as freebase. That isn’t universally true at all, but is a result of the salt formulations that are popular in the market.

        I worked with a scientist that once formulated a 20mg/mL solution for me that had similar throat hit to the 40mg/mL products I was using & had a very steep onset curve, and I found it to still be very satisfying even immediately after swapping. It wasn’t a successful product though because for the consumer, 20mg = 20mg & 40mg = 40mg

        Guess my point is that the novel ways of using tech to improve weaning off nicotine using vaping do legitimately exist, but they don’t have a place in a free market so we won’t have it while regulators stay luddites on the issue

        • Tekhne@sh.itjust.works
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          2 months ago

          That’s when you take a page out of the book of lightbulb manufacturers. On the box, CFLs and LEDs don’t show their actual wattage on the front, they write “100w equivalent” because that’s how people are used to measuring luminosity.

          • lad@programming.dev
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            2 months ago

            I find it changing as of lately, as “W equivalent”, lumens, and actual Watts get printed on the bulbs’ package more often, sometimes even pulsation score or something. This really helps because actual Watts and lumens are quite independent now

            • Tekhne@sh.itjust.works
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              2 months ago

              Yeah exactly, but to get to that point we needed to message it to consumers as such for ~20 years. Similarly, in OPs example, the 20mg feels similarly to a 40mg, but with half the nicotine - clearly the measurement on the box is being used as a proxy for “how does this feel” (no clue if that has a measurement/is measureable) but could definitely message it similarly

      • lad@programming.dev
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        2 months ago

        For those like me who have never heard of (E)VAPI or Honey Cut and want to read a disturbing story of how illicit products may be made of pretty much anything, there’s a read from Leafly

    • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      Mixing vape juice is standard practice though. You can buy nicottine free vape juice everywhere. If you splti 50mg with nic free at 50:50 you have… 25mg! It’s extremely common FYI

    • barsoap@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      Would you be saying the same thing if it was about diluting vodka with water?

      …because that’s what mixing vape juice with juice base is.

      • PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        Yes I would, tampering is dangerous shit even when you think you’re being benign about it.

        Not to mention the implicit overstepping of boundaries and violation of knowing consent.

        • barsoap@lemm.ee
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          2 months ago

          If I was making a cocktail for a friend, and, eyeballing the ratios, ended up putting too little vodka in it, would that still be tampering?

          • PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee
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            2 months ago

            If you can’t tell the difference between messing up a cocktail mix and intentionally tampering with a drink or drug formula I don’t know what to tell ya man.

            • barsoap@lemm.ee
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              2 months ago

              Noone is talking about medication.

              Everyone is talking about reducing the active ingredient in a serving of a recreational psychotropic drug by serving more of the (not “a”, but “the”) carrier dilute. If Anon’s GF doesn’t get the nic she needs, she’ll take more puffs. If you don’t get the buzz you want, you’ll ask for another cocktail.

              Y’all can ride on the technical definition of “tampering” but a) the cocktail mix not being as expected (e.g. “as done last time round”) would amount to the same, “Hey this Mojito is practically virgin!” and b) there’s a rather huge difference between diluting or strengthening the active ingredient and c) on a whole another escalation scale, adding something that’s not supposed to be in the serving at all. Like, dunno, CBD in a Bloody Mary. Yet another magnitude: Vitamin E acetate in vape juice (don’t do that that’s where the popcorn lung cases came from).

              Can you make those distinctions in your mind or is the concept of “tampering” mushing it all together?

          • Honytawk@lemmy.zip
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            2 months ago

            Your friend knew you were mixing it though

            If you were to go around a party pouring water in everybody’s drinks when they aren’t looking, I would consider that tampering, yes.

            • barsoap@lemm.ee
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              2 months ago

              If I were to hand everyone shots of pure tap water when they’re expecting vodka, would that be tampering?

              Note if you say “no” then you’re literally no fun at parties. Zero. Nilch. Less actually, you’re negative fun.

  • criitz@reddthat.com
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    2 months ago

    This is BS. By the third or fourth bottle shed be like wtf is up with this juice?

    (This reduction method helped me quit, but it’s not imperceptible like that)

    • chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world
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      I tapered off vaping using the same method, and there is a clear difference in the feeling of a pull when you cut the nicotine down. Also, you can’t just “cut” the nicotine, you’d have to find some way to enhance the flavor of the diluted mix otherwise it will just get more bland. All of that being said, this is a valid strategy for kicking it. Just buy lower nicotine content bottles until you get down to 0% nic, and if your your experience is like mine, you just wake up one day and don’t reach for the vape on the nightstand.

      • TurtlePower@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        As far as it being bland, that’s why you get the same flavor juice with 0 nicotine and cut it with that. It does reduce the “throat hit” (that feeling you’re talking about), but you still get the full flavor.

      • Zekas@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Mixed my own until I quit. You have to be vaping the exact same shit constantly to have the taste so dialled in. If it’s this slow a taper you’re never going to be notice from one week to the other. And while I didn’t use a ton, shortfills seemed fine to use with or without nicotine added. Just add less or replace with unflavoured liquid.

      • Rai@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        2 months ago

        If you mixed 50/50 VG/PG with the juice 1% at a time over months, the difference would be imperceptible. If a person vapes only one flavor, olfactory fatigue is going to take the flavor away way more than even a 50% cut.

        That all goes out the window if someone vapes different flavors, though.

    • Omgarm@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      It’s also BS because it is 4chan and a lot of their posts are untrue and homosexual.

    • gila@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      If they were vaping a whole 30ml bottle @ 50mg/mL per week, yeah probably. That’s a pretty extreme dependency. I don’t know anyone ingesting that much nic, after 7 years in vape industry / over a decade vaping myself. I’m not in the US though, Juul kinda fucked things up over there

        • Monkey With A Shell@lemmy.socdojo.com
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          Way back when there where flavored analog cigs, I think those got banned nationally for the same reason they claim now for vapes that it entices kids. Dumb thing about that argument though is you have a million different juice/soda/energy drinks out there, generally with much better flavors since they’re not worried about masking alcohol or nic, and yet the kids still go for the alcohol and nic. Maybe, it’s not just the flavors that kids are after…

      • ThirdWorldOrder@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        I’ve never in over 10 years seen 50mg/ml eliquid. This has to be salt nic right? Tried that once or twice and that stuff was bonkers. Been around the scene for a while too and even released a few recipes that are on the front page of ELR

        https://e-liquid-recipes.com/list?filter=11031

        I don’t see how this four Chan guy could have been able to pull off his claim… doesn’t really add up

        • gila@lemm.ee
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          2 months ago

          Yeah upon rereading the story there’s no shot, tampering with 50+ bottles of eliquid without breaking the break-off band or messing up the plug. Anon is basically a fly by night compounder

          But yeah, 35/50mg are the default strengths for majority USA salt nic eliquids off the shelf, the standard set by Juul upon first entering the market (though arbitrarily Juul measures by weight rather than by volume, so their pods are actually 59mg/mL)

          • ThirdWorldOrder@lemm.ee
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            2 months ago

            Nic salts give me wicked headaches so I don’t mess with them at all. Last time I got so light headed I almost fell. That’s saying a lot too since I used to Dip a lot back then.

    • Perfide@reddthat.com
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      2 months ago

      Did you actually lower by only a percentage a week, or were you doing the normal thing and just buying weaker juice? Commercial vape juices have multiple percentage differences in their nic content between the different “tiers” of juice. That would be much more sudden and noticeable than 1% a week lower.

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    2 months ago

    This is literally how I quit, except I did it intentionally.

    But this is fake because the jump from 0.001 to 0.000 was like the ground disappearing beneath my feet.

    For the previous week I was only using 0 nic juice in a pod that previously held a tiny amount of nic (we’re talking trace amounts near the end - I wasn’t feeling a thing).

    Anyway I thought I was going through withdrawal so hard with the 0 nic in the used pod, but NOPE switch to 0 nic in a fresh pod and it was like “welcome to withdrawal 2.”

    Still really happy I quit though. It’s so great not going into a panick whenever I misplace my vape for like 42 seconds. That was always so fucking humbling.

    • P0rkduck@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      I’ve also done this to quit vaping. I’ve quit cold turkey a couple times, but diluting like this was by far easier for me. Still difficult, especially when going to zero nic, but it worked.

      • grrgyle@slrpnk.net
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        2 months ago

        For sure, if cold turkey hasn’t worked for someone, I would recommend this option. As hard as it was, it actually stuck (haven’t had nic in several years), unlike the hundreds of other times I tried to quit

    • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      OP probably means 50mg which is standard high concentration nic salts (freebase is most commonly 3mg). People often mistake mg for percentage in vaping.

      • papalonian@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        But they claimed to have used dilution formulas to achieve these percentages. Pretty sure it’s BS.

        • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          I’m not going to argue that greentext is ever real but mixing vape juice and diluting is very common. I vape 3mg freebase 1:2 with nic-free for 1mg juice which has a very tiny nic kick. You can even mix flavors like Cola + Apple or cherry is just delicious :P

          • papalonian@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            I know you can, I do the same haha. What I’m saying is, they couldn’t have both accidentally read the 50mg as 50% while simultaneously claiming to have calculated exactly how much would be needed to dilute it to 49%, because diluting it to 49mg and 49% would be two different calculations and it’s unlikely they’d make that mistake after doing the calculations.

            • rhandyrhoads@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              I see what you’re saying, but for the sake of this end goal the difference between diluting by 1% (to 49.5 mg) vs 1 mg isn’t too big of a deal odds are they did it by percent of original nicotine, but the idea behind a taper stays pretty much the same.

        • GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca
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          2 months ago

          Math time.

          Let’s say it’s 50mg/30ml. To get to 49mg/30ml you need 49/50 of the original bottle or 29.4ml of the original concentration with the last bit being 0 nic.

          Now our hypothetical 50% nic bottle has 15ml nicotine. 49% would be 14.7ml. Now our original mix is 50%, so we have to add twice as much as that 14.7ml to get to 49%. 14.7×2= … 29.4ml.

          The cool thing about dimensional analysis is that once you cancel out your dimensions the math takes care of itself, same as if you’re using percentages. Anon may not know much about vape juice, but his math is on point.

          • papalonian@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            I’m not trying to be rude here, but the math is not my problem, I understand dimensional analysis.

            After doing that calculation, is it likely that you are going to mistake the term “percent” and “mg”, or after doing something so specific with units are you more likely to use the right one?

            I’m saying that if OP actually did any of this (you say their math is on point but they didn’t do any haha) they’d probably be using the correct term rather than the incorrect yet common “street” term

            • GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca
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              2 months ago

              The point of my math is that it doesn’t matter if it’s mg or percent. Assuming the bottles remain consistent, the difference for each step will be the same volume.

      • redfellow@sopuli.xyz
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        2 months ago

        I’ve vaped since 2013 and have literally never heard of this. Could be regional 💁‍♂️

          • redfellow@sopuli.xyz
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            2 months ago

            50mg is also a metric fucton of nic in a vape. My strong mixes are 13mg, and low nic is 4mg.

              • redfellow@sopuli.xyz
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                2 months ago

                When vapes came out and the devices were shitty and produced low amounts of vapor, the highest I saw was 30mg and 24mg, and the “marlboro red” equivalent was 18mg.

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        2 months ago

        Around these places, if anyone asks for “50% nic liquid”, they’d be promptly kicked out of the store. Chances are, that’d be kids that don’t know pure nicotine is ~1010mg/mL, or they do know and are asking for something highly illegal.

        Are you sure you’re not confusing it with PG/VG composition?

        • redfellow@sopuli.xyz
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          2 months ago

          I’ll chime in and say that 20mg is the highest legally sold concentration where I live. Mine is a small country though. I know Germany and Canada have the same max.

          • drathvedro@lemm.ee
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            Around here up until recently there were freebase liquids up to 24 and salts up to 65. You could even get your hands on 100mg freebase concentrate if you’re a shop owner or eliquid producer. But just a couple months earlier a law passed that limits all to 20 and puts extortionate taxes on all liquids no matter the concentration. Two of the biggest franchises straight up closed their entire businesses the moment it went through. The rest posted own obituaries on their sites about how fucked they are and how they are basically hanging by the thread now. But I think they’ve overreacted. Sure, the prices would go up at least 7 times, but in neighboring countries the limits are as low as 3mg if not outright banned, but business is still going. I myself just bought out the entire shelf from one of smaller stores that sold old stock from under the counter. Should last me until winter, but I think I’ll have to move to some better place by then.

    • Xanis@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      It is okay to assume something is real when it doesn’t hurt anyone. :)

      Cause maybe, juuust maybe, this story will help someone else.

      • arefx@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        I unironically did this to taper off nicotine and have been smoke/vape/nicotine free for 6 years

    • fossilesque@mander.xyz
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      2 months ago

      Man, I’d love to do this but I’d feel so bad lying. My partner is trying to stop though, so I am going to show him this juice. Successful marketing, I guess. Could be worse. :)

    • PrettyFlyForAFatGuy@feddit.uk
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      2 months ago

      meh, good intentions but tampering with someones consumables without permission is assault if you ask me.

      If she’s old enough to vape then she’s old enough to make the decisions for herself

          • Telodzrum@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            You’re getting shit because rape is an extremely serious act and diluting the severity of it by describing other violations with its language is not acceptable to most people.

            How hard would it have been to say “betrayal of trust” or “violation of personal property and control over what she puts in her body?”

            When you get lazy with your language we all suffer. Be better.

      • olutukko@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        but she also wanted to quit. this seems fine by me, cuz that shit ain’t healthy and anon wasnt forcing her the idea of quitting since she had already tried to do it herself, and the anon also wasn’t taking the feeling of winning away from her. just a little white lie to help her achieve her goals.

        if she wouldn’t want to quit though, that would be pretty fucked

        • PrettyFlyForAFatGuy@feddit.uk
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          “if she wouldn’t want to quit though”

          she didn’t really get a change to make that decision for herself though, did she?

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            2 months ago

            “get’s very frustrated with herself because she’s tried several times to quit”

            the second line bro

            • PrettyFlyForAFatGuy@feddit.uk
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              2 months ago

              i keep going back and looking for the bit where he specifically asked if he could start mixing random substances into her vape juice but i just can’t find it. perhaps you could point it out for me?

              Edit: “My gf was complaining about not being able to sleep so i started putting sleeping pills in her drinks”… that’s what you sound like

              • barsoap@lemm.ee
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                2 months ago

                Not random substances, just like diluting vodka with water is not mixing in a random substance.

              • olutukko@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                they never said random substances, you can literally just add the base substance to make it milder. drugging somebody is not comparable at all

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            2 months ago

            If she’s old enough to vape then she’s old enough to make the decisions for herself

            I’m not addressing the tampering stuff, I’m addressing this very misguided statement

  • Perfide@reddthat.com
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    2 months ago

    And then the gf decides she wants to try a new flavor, buys her “normal” nic strength, and fills her vape up with it before anon has a chance to dilute it.

    • Psythik@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      This would actually work out fine because she’d get he new bottle, hit it as hard as she did with her diluted bottles, then to proceed to throw up. The nausea alone from nicotine overdose should be a decent deterrent.

      • efstajas@lemmy.world
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        As someone who “quit” nicotine and picked it up again later multiple times… The first hit after a while felt amazing every time. Unfortunately. No nausea at all.

      • barsoap@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        Nausea isn’t overdose but that’s a technicality, what I wanted to say is that it’s quite hard to get to nausea off a single puff no matter the nic strength because it tastes, for lack of better term, sharp, very noticeably so. Coming off low-concentration juice you’d notice before the vapour goes past your tongue.

  • AItoothbrush@lemmy.zip
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    2 months ago

    Isnt fine tuning tour dosage literally the point of vapes? There are a lot of fluids with different levels of nicotine. Also from 50% you would fucking die. Its probably 50mg.

    • gila@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      It’s possible, but frequency is determined by more factors than simply relief from nicotine withdrawal. It’s also possible that reducing concentration very slightly doesn’t change the overall equation enough to actually drive behavioral change. But I’d agree that outcomes are better secured with conscious intent. I think quitting successfully and meaningfully means learning resilience against compulsion to engage in behaviors driven by chemical reactions in the brain, which this approach doesn’t do at all.

    • mosiacmango@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      Not if you only hit it in certain circumstances, i.e breaks at work, out drinking, etc.

      That kind of 1%/week gradual decrease would probably lead to less of an addiction to line up with less of a dose as well.

      • barsoap@lemm.ee
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        2 months ago

        Pure water will work for a couple of percentage points but above that will not work properly because atomisers expect a certain range of viscosity or they won’t wick properly. It’s generally a mix of propylene glycol, glycerine, and water. More glycerine means more clouds, natural sweetness, and annoying hygroscopy (i.e. you’ll get a dry mouth), while PG is an aroma carrier, less sweet, quite a bit less hygroscopic. It’s also the standard solvent for nicotine and aroma, not just vape aromas most food aromas are PG-based, too. Water is there to make the liquid less viscous and/or reduce hygroscopy of the overall mixture.

    • uis@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      It’s eazy to buy:

      10 liters - you will never need to buy again.

      • Allero@lemmy.today
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        2 months ago

        For those who literally just got a pic in Russian - this is a 10L (12,5kg) canister of 99,8% pure food-grade glycerol

        Автор, не забывай, что по-русски тут почти никто не говорит :D

        • uis@lemm.ee
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          2 months ago

          Это добавляло таинственности “разбавителю”. Вроде канистра, а вроде и не понятно.

          Вообще ещё лучше было бы, если на канистре была бы написана или изображена формула. Подсказка для знающих химию, но не знающих русский.

    • FrederikNJS@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      Why?

      Let’s say the original bottle contained 100ml of liquid at a concentration of 50%. You want to want to bring the final concentration down to 1%. You take a new bottle with 98ml of “dilution formula” (probably water) and add 2 ml of the original concentration to it. You now have a liquid with 1% concentration.

    • Monkey With A Shell@lemmy.socdojo.com
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      2 months ago

      How big a bottle and how efficient the vape? When I did regularly if I recall a 30 ml bottle would last about a week. That switching from a pack/day smoking for comparison of volume.

  • steeznson@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    The story is a bit controlling/manipulative in my opinion. Even if the net outcome is good I’d feel like I was overstepping a boundary if I did this to my partner.

    • Shampiss@sh.itjust.works
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      2 months ago

      It sounds so freaking fake too.

      Tbh, I hope it’s real and this woman is free from vape addiction. There’s a question here about boundaries but what strikes me the most is that I can’t take it seriously. The tone is just so characteristic of these 4chan green texts. No details, no heart. Straight to the point. Short enough to get a bunch of upvotes.

      He wrote it like it’s a simple story that happened within a week. It just feels manufactured

    • mihor@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      It’s not manipulation if the manipulatee benefits from it. Besides, he saved her from cancer. Fuck cancer.

      • hex@programming.dev
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        2 months ago

        Ehh, it’s still manipulation, yeah. No one should have that kind of control over you. What he should have done was talk to her about this method that might work to quit vaping, and help her do it. That way he’s not doing all this crap behind her back.

  • don@lemm.ee
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    2 months ago

    lmao that’s exactly what I did to quit nicotine altogether. Vaped off of cigarettes, then started lowering the nicotine until about of month of zero, then just stopped completely about two years ago.

    But this was when you could order custom nicotine level juice and get it sent though the mail. I figured out that this was too good to last, so I lowered my concentrations kinda quickly. This was fortunate, because not long after I quit, the last high quantity e-juice company I sourced from closed up shop.

    TBDLiquids, B-X Vapor, and Blue Dot Vapors, you were the GOAT.

    I still have the last half bottle or so of zero nicotine juice as a reminder. So glad I was able to beat the addiction in time.

    • qwerty
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      2 months ago

      Regulations having the exact opposite effect than desired. Classic.

  • Illuminostro@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    Serious question: is it just understood and accepted than almost every one the posts on 4chan are obvious fiction? Is it just an accepted part of the culture there?