egg-actly

wasn’t there something about it being considered misogynistic except if you’re in spain, then it’s considered normal?

I think the problem of egg culture is a deeper issue, it stems from the idea that one can make another person come out, or that a person’s identity can be “known” by others, even against that person’s identification. That last part is where the problem stems, “against that person’s identification”. Until and unless we can get over the idea that one can go against the way a person currently identifies, any new term we come up with to replace egg has the potential to be misused and abused in the same way.

I understand that people can be in denial and that people can change their minds over time, but that is part of the process. The best one can do is to offer support and discuss the idea of gender to someone who might not understand. Without outright telling them they are wrong or that what they’re doing isn’t normal. Some people might say that that isn’t enough and that some people need force. But it’s their choice, and their life. If someone doesn’t want to open their mind or identify differently they have every right to dig in their heels. The idea they don’t is where and when it becomes toxic and where and when it largely stops being affirming.

TL;DR A new term could help, but we have to get over and cease the current pushiness, or it too will become corrupted and abused in the same ways “egg” is.

Outsiders? What are you talking about? People get called eggs within trans communities. Violation of the egg prime directive happens almost exclusively within trans spaces from other trans people. Why is this so hard for you to understand or accept? I and others aren’t saying that trans people are evil and “trying to turn kids” or some dumb shit like that. We’re saying that a misguided or harmful group of trans people are acting in a way that is harmful to the community. Which isn’t a new concept might I add, transmedicalists anyone? What about right-wing trans people who fight against and undermine trans rights while trying to vilify other trans people who don’t share their beliefs, like actually vilify them, i.e. the groomer rhetoric. And yeah it is hypocritical, and damaging as fuck.

Do you understand now? Is it clearer now?

Unfortunately the blowback of such discourse in practice is just people giving me grief for trying to use the word as a shorthand to “me pre-realization” and indirectly calling me a creep if I even mention considering transitioning in any direction in a passive way because even being compared to a trans person causes certain people to damn near flinch reflexively.

With all due respect “Jesse what the fuck are you talking about?”. No one is talking about your ability to call your past self an egg, and no one is giving you shit for you considering transition yourself. You are getting flack right now because you are denying and attempting to excuse the very real fact that there are people in the community who do not respect the way other people identify, who argue and insist that a person who is gender non-conforming must be whatever gender they present as. The example given was that people say that femboys are transfem or trans girls in denial. But great job trying to poison the well and make it out as if we’re attacking you, or that there’s some aggression or hostility towards trans people here.

What I am most confused by is people implying that it’s immoral to even consider asking someone (irl you’d just use your words - have you considered it? - the idea that the word “egg” implies that being trans is rigidly prescribed from the outside from some tactless strangers trying to blindly out other strangers rather than two peple who know each other politely asking one-on-one in a respectful conversation is kinda wild to me - am I just confused because I managed to dodge significantly stupider online discourse elsewhere and am instead taking this literally?).

Except having a polite conversation where you talk to a person about gender identity and make them feel comfortable is not what any of us are talking about when we talk about people being called eggs or the egg prime directive, or people breaking the egg prime directive. Someone saying that “it’s not cis” for someone to dress that way isn’t doing that either. It is making a statement about their gender based on gender stereotypes. The idea that the calling people eggs thing is just polite conversation meant to make people feel safe is at best a strawman argument, and at worst is another attempt to poison the well.

Also do you think term “egg” only applies to people “suspected of being women”?

I just used it here because it’s very common. I’ve seen it happen to tomboys people think are transmasc, or enbies. It is also used legitimately, as a past tense referral for a person before they came out or realized themselves. I haven’t gone into those as much because they are off-topic, this subject is related to the wrongful use of the term, to refer to other people in the present tense.

Then there’s the sub Reddit and several Lemmy communities called egg_irl which accuse people of being an egg due to something they said or a picture they shared.

I think that’s where “egg” is used badly

Definitely, it’s almost always either someone that’s not quite ready to come out or trans people talking about their pre-transition selves. There is a small minority of people who are very insistent on calling other people eggs and seem to think they’re helping, but really are contributing to an environment with more rigid gender roles.

It’s unfortunate because a lot of the time I think what they’re really wanting to do is talk about their own experiences and how things clicked together for them, but are way overgeneralizing about it and projecting it onto other people.