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It’s not even satire anymore.
how can it even be nowadays
Agreed. This internet will help you find evidence to support any stance.
Civil rights for black people alienate the working class
—same satirical headline in the 50s
You mean -probably real headline from the 50s
In less than ten years, I saw three of my cousins transition. This seemed to correspond neatly with trans-rights being mainstreamed as a social issue. Almost as though there are a lot of trans-people, many of whom were simply in the closet until the moment it became socially acceptable to be themselves.
There absolutely are a lot of them; it’s great that they finally feel comfortable to be themselves.
We saw the same thing with gay people. I’m an 80’s kid. When I was young, gay was something you saw on TV and in the movies. There ‘were no gay kids’ at the schools I attended. Because that was simply not something that you could admit to being.
Earlier this year I met a teen girl at work who casually mentioned her girlfriend. I was delighted that kids these days are comfortable enough in their own skin to just say that to someone they just met. That was not a thing when I was her age. It’s nice to see how far we’ve come.
Huh. I’ve met this guy on lemmy.
Hey! I know a trans person and I’m sure some of my acquintances are blue collar.
Why subtweet Hillary Clinton on this one? It’s almost an exact quote.
Link it homie!
It’s not as close to an exact quote as I thought, to be honest, but I stand by the sentiment that the statement was unsupportive of the trans community.
My espresso has arrived. Clinton asks for more iced tea. I cannot allow the lunch to end without questioning the direction of her party. I say that Democrats seem to be going out of their way to lose elections by elevating activist causes, notably the transgender debate, which are relevant only to a small minority. What sense does it make to depict JK Rowling as a fascist? To my surprise, Clinton shares the premise of my question.
“We are standing on the precipice of losing our democracy, and everything that everybody else cares about then goes out the window,” she says. “Look, the most important thing is to win the next election. The alternative is so frightening that whatever does not help you win should not be a priority.”
From an interview with the Financial Times
I’d note 4 things:
- The question is obviously heavily framed as an anti-trans question
- A lot of right wing news outlets reported the initial question as if Clinton herself was the one who said it, which isn’t true.
- Most non-right-wing outlets didn’t mention the context that she was responding to a question about trans people at all
- She never retracted or clarified her statement after the fact
I bet she wonders why she didn’t win to this day.
Trans rights are human rights, working class are human.
Yes I ate the onion but I know well meaning ‘progressives’ like this and they infuriate me
The ones I’ve met have all been centrists, eager to throw vulnerable minorities under the bus in their endless and fruitless quest to appease fascists.
Bold of you to call terminally online MLs democrats.
Before Stonewall: Queer liberation’s Communist Party roots
That might sound like a big claim to make, but it was Communist ideology and political strategy that provided the theoretical and practical architecture of the earliest effort to win gay equality in the United States—the Mattachine Society, a group whose ideas underpinned all the struggles and victories in the country that have been won over the past half century. Without them, there would no doubt have been a movement for queer equality in one form or another, as there were already stirrings elsewhere prior to Mattachine, especially in Europe. But without Mattachine, the movement that emerged would likely have looked a lot different than it does now.
I prefer Machetecine.
Republicans obviously think persecuting trans people is a winning issue. Should Democrats not put a comparable amount of effort into defending them?
Political strategists are there to make party win even if it hurts the feelings of a minority, more news at 6
Political strategists are there to make
party winthemselves money even if it hurts the feelings of a minority, more news at 6So many of these consultants just exist to restate the bigotries and biases of the candidate, in hopes that they’ll be hired on as Yes-Men in a doomed campaign. The GOP has been overplaying its hand on trans-politics since the Obama era. Candidates that run on this shit routinely get washed in all but the safest elections, because they sound like freaks when they run around town posting weird AI art with “IS THIS A WOMAN?!?! VOTE FOR ME!!!” next to it.
But because its become such a baked-in GOP strategy, we’re now forced to treat “When can a mall cop grope your daughter’s crotch to check if she’s secretly a man?” as a serious campaign question.
Strategists don’t care. They know their campaign is paid for by a bunch of bible-thumping neanderthals. So this kind of campaigning just won’t stop. Because, paradoxically, the losing only makes people madder and more conspiracy-minded and more willing to throw good money after bad.
feelingsrights FTFYCampaign promises don’t hurt any rights because they don’t need to be kept, they’re required to be elected.
They’re passing anti-trans laws left and right at the state level. Always assume a Republican is telling the truth when they talk about planning to do something awful.
Also campaign promises do hurt because they normalize persecution of minority groups.
In Republican States, no Democrats has campaigned on trans rights yet they actually do things to protect their rights once elected, that’s political strategy.
With friends like those, who needs enemas? (I know, Onion headline. Still, I’m sure there are plenty of people just like him all over the world. Try again ki- Moo hoo ha ha ha!)
Most working-class voters I know are alienated by phrasing, but rarely by pro-LGBT positions alone. Trans rights are very viable for working-class support, you just have to find the right phrasing for it.
It’s not about being anti trans, it never was.
It’s about being practical in the real world. Trans people rights are people rights are human rights, everyone should have the same rights.
However, Making this your primary issue will get you some voters but turn away more voters that you need to get elected. You can’t help anyone if you don’t get elected
These ‘x issues are dividing the working class’ lines is just trickle-down economics with race/ gender/ orientation etc.
I am so sick and tired about hearing about trans issues. Outrageously disproportionate to the real issues we need to focus on.
It wouldn’t be a conversation if the alt right media would stop acting as if transgender people are causing all their problems.
It’s best to just ignore the alt-right media.
That’s not what is happening. It seems more like trans people are screaming constantly that we are trying to kill them and other insane shit.
Shit I got banned from steams Halls of Torment forums by a trans for saying I did not want identity politics in the games I play.
It’s not the alt right that is the problem here. It’s people being unable to relax the fuck out and just live life without making their sexuality an explicit part of everyone else’s awareness.
Wow you went mask off real quick there.
Few things to point out in case you didn’t know them:
- Gender has literally nothing to do with sexuality
- Trans people are literally being killed. Thinking they are annoying for discussing that in public says a lot about what your priorities are.
- All art is political and games are art.
- I feel like every time recently people have complained about trans stuff in games it’s because the dev added an option to select your pronouns… In which case, it literally does not affect you as soon as you finish character creation.
They went mask off so fast that I’m surprised we didn’t hear a sonic boom.
Nah. It’s you. The problem is you.
“I don’t want to see this aspect of life that doesn’t affect me at all in this video game”
Gets banned
“How could the trans people do this and oppress people”
“Art needs to stop imitating life!”
Hey look, they wrote an article about you.
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What exactly do you mean with identity politics in the game? Why do you even bring it up on the forums? Is the game letting you select pronouns? Do you pick a body instead of “sex” in the character selection screen? Are you forced to undergo gender reassignment surgery upon logging into the game?
Also, gender does not mean sexuality. They are 2 separate things.
I am not trans. I am not LGBT. I’m an ally but i have never had any issues with LGBT people. Never ever have i felt like anything is “shoved down my throat”, forced or whatever on me. Never have they ever even had a big conversation about it with me. The ONLY thing we talked about was when i meet someone and they tell me their pronouns. He, she, they or whatever else they want. Then i respond with “okay cool” and thats the end of it.
I really don’t understand why you feel like its the only thing we talk about? The right brings it up 24/7 and when they see anyone even with a pride flag in their profile, or maybe their pronouns, they have an absolute baby meltdown.
The issue is you mate. Even how you say “banned by a trans”. Who talks like that? You seem uncomfortable with it and therefore annoyed and upset. Chill and stop worrying so damn much about others…
Haha, you have to create a new troll account now because you fucked this one up.
How do you square what you’re saying with the very easy to find data (look it up) that says that trans people are disproportionately killed by a large amount and the easy to find laws being passed around the US using taxpayer money to specifically target trans people by denying them recognition and healthcare?
When trans people “relax the fuck out and just live life” they end up being denied jobs, medicine, and sometimes their life by bigots. What do you think they’re supposed to do?
Maybe they will stop screaming when we stop murdering them. https://www.statista.com/chart/30779/map-of-trans-and-gender-diverse-people-killed/
Interpretation note: there is a smaller list of cases where it’s confirmed they were murdered for being trans. There is a gray area between likely and unlikely that trans-hate was the motive.
It’s not the alt-right! It’s just…*proceeds to regurgitate bog-standard alt-right talking points*
FTFY
Shit I got banned from steams Halls of Torment forums by a trans for saying I did not want identity politics in the games I play.
I’ve played Halls of Torment. It’s a Vampire Survivors style game (pick a character, kill hordes of mobs). Where the hell did you find identity politics in it? Does the “back story” of a character on a wiki say they are trans or something?
“Trans people need to stop being in my face by acknowledging that trans people exist if I go looking into the extended backstory that isn’t part of the game at all!!!”
A real gamer in their habitat, so rare to find it on lemmy.
What minority you want out of your game today?
- learn to walk and chew gum
- it’s not supposed to be proportional to the “real” issues, it’s proportional to the political violence used against them.
- trans issues are real issues, because trans rights are human rights. and they’re under attack.
why do you think they always pick minorities to attack? first they come for a tiny minority, so apathetic dickwads don’t speak up because they’re not part of that minority. wonder where i heard that before.
I agree with you both. I wish we would stop hearing about them because trans rights were no longer under attack.
trans rights are no longer under attack.
Yes they are, you’ve just stopped hearing about it because the Democrats mostly stopped playing defense for them. Turns out a tiny minority has a very small voice when it isn’t being amplified by people with access to power and privilege. It’s similar to the way Democrats now support right-wing border policy despite paying lip service to leftist ideas about the border and immigration. It’s just another cause the Democrats cynically co-opted until it was no longer convenient.
Did you miss the “I wish” part. Jesus, settle down keyboard warrior.
I misread your comment, that’s my mistake. I thought you were saying that trans rights no longer being under attack is why you wish you would stop hearing about them.
I edited the “are” to “were.” Hope that helps the misunderstanding of my comment.
Ah, yes, trans rights are no longer under attack.
Are you legally brain dead?
ANOTHER ONE that can’t fucking read? 🙄
Note the, “I wish” part
I edited “are” to “were.” I don’t know if that will help or not.
It’s not that I can’t read, it’s that your syntax is lacking. Good edit. It helps a bit. Can still be interpreted the other way.
not after the edit
i mean, it’s the right that’s currently trying to make laws banning trans care. the left just wants them to be left alone. as soon as the right stops trying to ban them the left will stop having anything to complain about
I found the guy in the meme
I’m sorry but who do you think is next? We’ve seen this movie before. At the end of the day only loyal, God fearing, white, land owning people, in good community standing will be safe.
That’s why we’re fighting for the rights of less than 1 percent of the population. Because until we live in a country where everyone’s rights are secure, no one’s rights are secure.
And if you don’t believe me go check out Christian Nationalism. It’s not exactly subtle and it is driving the modern Republican party.
Outrageously disproportionate to the real issues
How often have I heard anti-trans rhetoric in the last few years? Why is it always used as a wedge issue to
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Privatize public institutions - schools, parks, health clinics, public transit
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Ramp up police enforcement and surveillance on the working class
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Crack down on union organizing and other labor movements (particularly teacher and nurse unions)
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Elevate “naturalist” rhetoric used to entrench gender bias (only boys can do X and only girls can do Y, but trans people are trying to cheat! Keep the genders divided!)
Hell, I even see it worm its way into subjects like climate change reform, with the old Alex Jones “They’re turning the frogs gay!” rhetoric intended to deflect from the impact rising temperatures has on the ecology by convincing people there’s a Homosexual Agenda behind their ecological problems.
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Yeah it’s funny being told by leftwing media darlings that they’re so much more in touch with working people than me, I’d love to see that satirical content creator come and live my life with me for a week then see if he still feels smug enough to say that.
It’s a wedge issue designed to avoid talking about things that will actually help people, including trans people, to live decent lives. The left loves an excuse to call people bigots, racists, and whatever type of monster means that they can avoid actual meaningful change.
I mean I understand the point. The left does a great job of creating noise about issues that affect low numbers of people that end up galvanizing more opposition than it generates in votes. If the thing you advocate for ends up getting more votes against it rather than for it due to your advocacy, you just hurt your own cause.
Long term strategy is key.
Trans rights are human rights.
Advocating for human rights shouldn’t require a mathematical calculation of how many humans are affected.
It shouldn’t, but it does. We do not live in a perfect world.
When doctors at the emergency room have to make decisions about who to treat first, they follow guidelines like this one. Those help save lives, by making sure that those patients who need the most urgent care get it first.
In the same way, elevating LGBT issues above more pressing needs of the general population doesn’t help anyone, not even LGBT people.
How does gender-affirming care help someone who is homeless and jobless with no healthcare? Is proper pronoun awareness really more important than environmental protection, or combating political corruption?
Just to be clear, I 100% agree that trans rights are human rights. It is an important issue, and deserves attention. But what about black lives matter? Isn’t that important anymore? Are we still on that bandwagon, or did it get old? (I realize I’m getting snarky here, my apologies)
Addressing the unnecessary suffering of minority groups of all kinds is important. But putting them above issues that are critical to the survival of our society as a whole hurts everyone, even the people that these policies are designed to help.
You are making the mistake of assuming only one thing can be done at a time, and if everyone is not focused on “the most important thing” at all times then it is inefficient. This is not only untrue, it causes nothing to progress because nobody can agree on what the “most important thing” is.
Things can be worked on in parallel. While a group works on how to best address homelessness, another group can address LGBT issues while yet another group tackles environmental protection.
You can’t just throw everyone on a single problem or it becomes less efficient. Sure, 2 people can sweep the floor faster than 1 person, but if you try to get 100 people sweeping the floor in order to “prioritize it and get it done faster” it’s going to be a nightmare and never get finished.Having one person sweep the floors, another clean the windows, another do the dishes, another do the laundry, another make dinner, another wash the dog, another mow the lawn, another tidy the living room, etc. Is going to have the house clean and in shape a lot faster than if you have all those people make dinner (because dinner is the most important) and then have everyone mow the lawn, only after the lawn is finished have everyone do the laundry…
And all of this ignores the fact that I am not in government. I cannot meaningfully address the homelessness issue. I can stand up for the rights of trans people.
Maybe I could form a group to try to find the most effective methods of addressing homelessness and send our findings to the government. Okay, once we’ve done that now what? Government takes time, homelessness still exists, I guess we double check our research? Yup, research still looks good, our findings still stand. Guess we’ll send that to the government as well. But there’s still homelessness and homelessness is more important that human rights. (Sorry, trans rights. Trans rights are less important because there are less of them and neither you nor I are trans.) So seeing as homelessness still exists and is more important I guess we triple check the research? I’m pretty sure it’s right, but homelessness isn’t over so we can’t spend any amount of effort on something else because that would be inefficient.Well that’s the internet for ya: I agree with you, of course we can work on more than one thing at a time, and right, we don’t work in government, so we should personally take responsibility for what we can do ourselves.
Feels to me like we are really on the same page, we’re juat arguing over details.
Building a large working class movement is difficult when you have a bunch of socially conservative landmines that can divide people. The War on Queerness has always and forever been a war on the working class - often the youngest and most vulnerable, at that. The socio-economic benefits of this hostility only ever accrues to the entrenched establishment.
Fear of alienating the mainstream by withholding support for minority groups only empowers authoritarians who profit from a divided public.
Jews are a very small part of the population. If Republicans were passing laws specifically to persecute Jews, would you be making the same excuses for ignoring it? None of us are free until all of us are.
My understanding of the history of the fediverse, such as it is, is that it was initially used by marginalized groups. Specifically LGBTQ people who felt (and in fact were) persecuted on other platforms.
Trans rights are a core issue to many people here. This is likely why your take is being met with outright rejection by so many.
I understand. But all the down votes and hurt feelings in the world don’t change the validity of my point. It is entirely possible to hurt a cause by generating more opposition than support.
Are we here to virtue signal or win?
No. The people affected by hateful policy are “creating noise.” The Democrats are just the only ones willing to listen and try to help.
Takes 2 to tango.
